The Guardian: "Time to challenge Argentina’s white European self-image, black history experts say"

Renzi

Registered
Basically Liverpool would have probably kicked up a stink because Suarez was banned for 3 matches I think for calling Patrice Evra Negrito.
Apparently some Spanish language ‘expert’ had claimed that it was racist.
Not a supporter of either team but Suárez's punishment was obscene in this situation when Captain Wifeshagger John Terry was only banned for 4 matches for calling someone a "f--- black c---, fucking knobhead." Evra's was understandably offended to a degree, because nègre in French doesn't usualy have a polite colloquial usuage the was negro or negrito/a has in Spanish, and he presumably wouldn't have been aware of the difference. But you'd think Uruguay was some kind of backward racist hellhole (like much of rural America or Britain) from the way its players have been disproportionately punished and attacked by the FA and the British media.

I wonder what kind of "expert" was consulted. In my Spanish grammar class at UBA, we've discussed "el lenguaje inclusivo" meanwhile we still refer to bold text as letras en negrita. One of my favotite Colombian musicians, Leonor González Mina, is affectionately called La Negra Grande de Colombia (even a recent documentary about her on TVP used the nickname).
 

Renzi

Registered
This is not entirely true. Evra asked Suarez "why did you kick me" and Suarez replied "because you are black". Only those two players know 100% what happened but it went through investigation and Suarez was found guilty by the Independent Regulatory Commission. Telling someone you kicked them during a game because they are black (he used "negro" not "negrito" too) is different to calling someone negrito on your social media account. Suarez argues he said "why black?" as in, "por que negro" asking why they were arguing. He says he did not say "because you are black". Again, he was found guilty by the investigation and it is also worth noting Evra speaks five languages, including Spanish. He knows how the words are used.

Despite that, the thing that is remembered most about that episode is the awful way Liverpool F.C. handled that situation. The club would have been pilloried if they pulled that t-shirt bullshit today. And of course, FIFA's response... Sepp Blatter said racism on the field should be solved with a handshake. And people wonder why racism in football is still a thing.
Another version that's circulated was that all he said was "venga negrito" or something similar. Like you said, only the players really know. But if your version is true, and if he kicks people for "being black," then does that mean he bites people for being Serbian, or Italian?
 

semigoodlookin

Registered
Another version that's circulated was that all he said was "venga negrito" or something similar. Like you said, only the players really know. But if your version is true, and if he kicks people for "being black," then does that mean he bites people for being Serbian, or Italian?
That's cause he likes the taste.
 

semigoodlookin

Registered
Not a supporter of either team but Suárez's punishment was obscene in this situation when Captain Wifeshagger John Terry was only banned for 4 matches for calling someone a "f--- black c---, fucking knobhead." Evra's was understandably offended to a degree, because nègre in French doesn't usualy have a polite colloquial usuage the was negro or negrito/a has in Spanish, and he presumably wouldn't have been aware of the difference. But you'd think Uruguay was some kind of backward racist hellhole (like much of rural America or Britain) from the way its players have been disproportionately punished and attacked by the FA and the British media.

I wonder what kind of "expert" was consulted. In my Spanish grammar class at UBA, we've discussed "el lenguaje inclusivo" meanwhile we still refer to bold text as letras en negrita. One of my favotite Colombian musicians, Leonor González Mina, is affectionately called La Negra Grande de Colombia (even a recent documentary about her on TVP used the nickname).
Evra absolutely knows the difference, he speaks Spanish. Well enough to have started the argument by telling Suarez "concha de tu madre".

Terry's was actually a very similar situation. Ferdinand says he called him a "f*%$ black c%£" while Terry says he was saying "Anton, do you think I called you a f%&$ black c&^8?".

What is funny about Terry's is he is so obviously lying because his version makes no sense. For what it is worth I think Suarez is lying too and knew exactly what he was saying and how he wanted to say it. He was hiding behind his culture, which is completely different to the Cavani situation. Suarez's punishment was not obscene,Terry's was the obscene punishment as it should have been worse.

Finally, it is not my version but the version released by the indpendent investigation. Basically they believed Evra's retelling of the conversation over Suarez. Personally, I think Suarez is not lying about what he said ("por que negro") but he said it purposely to wind Evra up by using the word negro. He leaves that detail out of his denials.

Just becaue "negro" is used more positively in some situations here, that does not mean it cannot be used in malice.
 

semigoodlookin

Registered
Was just doing some research on this because my memory is at its limit and it seems Suarez is also found to have said "I don't speak with blacks". It is either Evra is making up a whole conversation or Suraez was saying some offensive things.
 

Renzi

Registered
Was just doing some research on this because my memory is at its limit and it seems Suarez is also found to have said "I don't speak with blacks". It is either Evra is making up a whole conversation or Suraez was saying some offensive things.

Maybe he doesn't speak to "blacks" but has bitten one. His first known victim was a Dutch player of North African descent.

 

cuando_volverá

Registered
There was an interesting case last November in England with Cavani (an Uruguayan all time great, playing currently for Manchester United):
View attachment 7757
One of his friends from Uruguay congratulating him on scoring a goal (asi te quiero Matadorr!!!!), he simply responded to him "Gracias negrito" (which is obviously his friend's nickname). It goes without saying that there was no racist intention, nor did he think that it cause a problem.
Result:
* three match ban
* 100k GBP fine (140k USD)
* had to an anti-racism training
* he was branded as a racist in the media

You might well argue that there are insensitivities in Argentina (and Uruguay for that matter) towards racism, but you can certainly also make the point that the woke, PC culture especially in the UK and US has gone too far.
I guess Cavani didn't learn anything from the Luis Suarez / Patrice Evra incident.
 

Alpinista

Registered
I guess Cavani didn't learn anything from the Luis Suarez / Patrice Evra incident.
In the aftermath of this incident, Uruguay's Academia Nacional de Letras said the words "negro" or its diminutive "negrito" -- similar to "gordo" (fatso) or "gordito" and "flaco" (skinny one) -- are commonly used as terms of endearment. "In the Spanish of Uruguay, for example, in couples or among friends, between parents and children, one often hears and reads expressions such as... gordito, negri, negrito..." the academy said in a statement.

Many South American or Argentinian players dont master the English language even after playing there for many years (Tevez, Agüero come to mind), and most certainly they are not able to understand the PC culture they live in. They are not future Nobel prize winners, but it doesn’t make them racist either.

And finally i dare to say that Suarez is - as he has shown throughout his carreer - a very dirty player. Cavani has nothing to do with him in this regard.
 
Top