20 De Diciembre..dia De Saqueous??

[nicoenarg]

Just saw some people protesting because there is no electricity and they're complaining about the heat. I can understand that. Its crazy hot right now. What I can't understand is that they've also lit some stuff on fire...maybe someone should stop them and tell them that fire is only going to make matters worse?

 

[EdRooney]

Just saw some people protesting because there is no electricity and they're complaining about the heat. I can understand that. Its crazy hot right now. What I can't understand is that they've also lit some stuff on fire...maybe someone should stop them and tell them that fire is only going to make matters worse?

Mrs EdRooney suggested last night we hook the caceroleros up to a generator. As for this particular lot, do they understand that lighting things on fire makes things hotter?

 

[nicoenarg]

They've been without power and some without water for the last 3 days. Apart from the fire, I can understand their protesting.

 

[EdRooney]

I see alot of protesting as positive: especially when it's constructive, has specific feasible demands and has a clear possibility of working to achieve those demands. Then there's other protesting that can be compared to someone honking the horn in a traffic jam. What that driver is really doing is not working towards any kind of solution, but rather just taking out her aggression on her horn and on those who have to listen to it. The burning couches clearly seem to be an example of #2.

And just to show I'm not totally callous, in the last three days we've had about 8 hrs total of electricity, and yes it blows.

 

[mc kenna]

I may be wrong on this, but I would only avoid the microcentro (and perhaps, balvanera, congreso, etc) but theres no reason to panic, it is all planned by Moyano and some unions, and some other people, police, etc, I think the quilombo will be only in Microcentro. I repeat I can be wrong.

SO in other words GO AHEAD AND PAAAANICCCCC run runnn for your life or i might be wrong and no need to panic
I gonna go for panic a little bit and get ammo food water spirits and tobacco and lock myself in the basement until all is clear........ maybe 2016?

 

[Gringoboy]

Mckenna, you'll need to read this then:
(substitute as necessary)
http://www.buzzfeed.com/tomphillips/how-the-media-will-report-the-apocalypse

 

[Matiasba]

SO in other words GO AHEAD AND PAAAANICCCCC run runnn for your life or i might be wrong and no need to panic
I gonna go for panic a little bit and get ammo food water spirits and tobacco and lock myself in the basement until all is clear........ maybe 2016?

What I meant is that theres no social situation for saqueos like we had in 1989 and 2001. So probably nothing more than a protest will happen. BUT, there are a lot of people envolved, police, Moyano, CGT, Unions, and A LOT of people ready to make some noise, so something could happen. But there is not a situation to that.

 

[nicoenarg]

I see alot of protesting as positive: especially when it's constructive, has specific feasible demands and has a clear possibility of working to achieve those demands. Then there's other protesting that can be compared to someone honking the horn in a traffic jam. What that driver is really doing is not working towards any kind of solution, but rather just taking out her aggression on her horn and on those who have to listen to it. The burning couches clearly seem to be an example of #2.

And just to show I'm not totally callous, in the last three days we've had about 8 hrs total of electricity, and yes it blows.

That analogy falls apart since the people and the government in this country are not on an equal footing.

The comparison, if you want to use a traffic/road analogy, that is more proper would be if a pedestrian sets a couch on fire to protest against a driver who is intent on running the pedestrian over. Sure setting the couch on fire doesn't fix problems but try dialoging with someone who's hell bent on running you over and then tell me if you're able to get somewhere with it.

This government's made it a habit of theirs to label anyone disagreeing with them as "militar" or "gorila" or what have you. Last time I checked, they weren't interested in dialog. Like I said before, I don't think setting things on fire helps, but I don't think their protest is as pointless as some driver pointlessly honking their horn.

You may look at things differently, doesn't make what they're doing worthless.

 

[EdRooney]

Nico, I think you may be misunderstanding my analogy.

Take for example, protests that have been successful at overthrowing oppressive power systems, such as the various actions in the US civil rights movement or the anti-apartheid boycott movement in South Africa. The actions that were taken (e.g., lunch counter sit-ins, bus strikes) always had a goal beyond "I'm raging mad about this so I'm going to make a stink". They rather had to do with intense organisation, community action, planning, strategies for success, conscious-raising work, etc. In fact, I think you would be hard-pressed to find a popular movement that overcame a power system by people just being made as heck. I can't think of any offhand. Even here in 2001, the amazing thing was to see grassroots groups organise the change that came from below.

IMHO, the same thing will have to be done here again, and will always have to be done. Community organising from the bottom-up. In contrast, six people banging on pots and pans, keeping up everyone else who wants to sleep aren't working toward a common goal; theyre just venting.

 

[EdRooney]

And one other thing...

About your point about this government calling people gorilas, militars... when you successfully defy a power system, the power system does not shrink away and say "thanks for dismantling me!" No, they always fight back tooth and nail, so in opposition to the government's policies we should always expect them to push back, but that should never damper the organising work necessary to continue the fight.