Covid Vaccination Argentina

[Somewhereinba]

Why would Pfizer not want to sell vacines here? Probably because they knew they would never be paid.

They also have a legal responsibility to accurately report income sources being publicly listed companies. Does anyone really think the Russian Government or Chinese backed vaccine makers have any obligation to report any payment terms and details? lol

 

[FrankPintor]

Why would Pfizer not want to sell vacines here? Probably because they knew they would never be paid.

They wanted to be treated as a state actor with liens on state assets. I don’t remember that was the actual problem though, there were other problems with the term “negligence” and also with Aerolíneas transporting the vaccines, which honestly was bloody silly given that Aerolíneas has transported millions of doses of vaccine without a single incident.

 

[antipodean]

Has the Government posted prices they are paying for the variety of vaccines? From what I read Sinopharm is actually not cheap so why would Argentina reject Pfizer when its clearly a better vaccine?

Yes, Argentina is confirmed as paying the following. Sputnik $9,95 a dose. Sinopharm $20,00 a dose. AstraZenaca and COVAX $4,00 a dose.

Regarding the comments around ability to pay for vaccines, I don't actually think it is not able to pay for the shipments in dollars when it falls due.
If we look at the government expenditure the original budget for vaccines was already exceeded by x4 by March 2021 - resulting in yet more money being asked for. AFAIK there has been nothing from COVAX or any lab to support the idea that they have difficulty paying or requesting financing and we know Argentina already made significant downpayments to some labs etc.

Regarding your suspicions about the choice of vaccines ultimately being down to some side-business in typical Argentine government fashion, I would tend to agree that judging by their actions they are prefering labs that can more easily facilitate more opaque dealings:

• In Jujuy the governor who is arranging direct purchase of Sinopharm vaccines was quoted as saying "intermediarios" appeared asking for extortionate prices (this is a common form of corruption here especially involving government contracts, for example you pay and recieve a factura for $20 but only $15 reaches the company you are supposedly doing business with as due to some alleged technicality or another you can't buy/import/distribute/fast-track the product without one)
• As we know, AstraZenaca was chosen for purchase by the government largely because it would be produced here in partnership with a private Argentine lab and a private Mexican lab. The purchase is not from AstraZenaca in the UK but the separate and private Argentine lab. The Mexican side is bankrolled by Carlos Slim and the Argentine side by Hugo Sigman - a businessman will well known links to Kirchnerism. His labs were raided in April under court order to search for documentation related to contracts with the government. (I would suspect that IF there was foul play, this one would be more a case of putting money in the hat - you pay me $4, you get $0,20 or something like this... very hard to ever actually prove without knowing who or what you're looking for)
  • This article also states that the government already made a 60% downpayment amounting to around US$54.000.000 despite not reiving any vaccines from them until now
• This week it was announced that Sputnik V would also be produced here by Richmond Labs, another private Argentine lab listed locally. This lab also received government credits to help finance production here that allegedly sent its stock price soaring by 38%. Richmond whose president Marcelo Figueras allegedly has close links with Kirchnerism also and tends to get a good amount of business under them thanks to the Ministry of Health.
• As for Pfizer, even Vizotti admits they never asked for glaciers or did the government ask for bribes. I believe her. Instead the government found some vague legal technicality that the common-man has difficulty comprehending as apparently not even the policymakers can explain it clearly. As a result the government continues to throw its money at the above-mentioned sources.

Usually things just need a little bit of time to start floating to the surface, especially after a feeding-frenzy. At least it should be an entertaining season in the telenovela that is Argentina, whichever way it turns out.

 

[antipodean]

** A clarification regarding my above words regarding AstraZenaca "The purchase is not from AstraZenaca in the UK but the separate and private Argentine lab." ...The government contracted AstraZenaca UK directly, who in turn buys the vaccines it sells to Argentina from the above-mentioned labs in Argentina / Mexico, delivered to Argentina by the Mexican lab. Meaning IF there was foul play it could be more like "for each dose you buy, AstraZenaca UK pays me (Argentine lab) $1 to produce X component, you get $0,2 in the hat." plus whatever scheme the Mexican lab could have of its own, etc.

 

[Somewhereinba]

Yes, Argentina is confirmed as paying the following. Sputnik $9,95 a dose. Sinopharm $20,00 a dose. AstraZenaca and COVAX $4,00 a dose.

Regarding the comments around ability to pay for vaccines, I don't actually think it is not able to pay for the shipments in dollars when it falls due.
If we look at the government expenditure the original budget for vaccines was already exceeded by x4 by March 2021 - resulting in yet more money being asked for. AFAIK there has been nothing from COVAX or any lab to support the idea that they have difficulty paying or requesting financing and we know Argentina already made significant downpayments to some labs etc.

Regarding your suspicions about the choice of vaccines ultimately being down to some side-business in typical Argentine government fashion, I would tend to agree that judging by their actions they are prefering labs that can more easily facilitate more opaque dealings:

• In Jujuy the governor who is arranging direct purchase of Sinopharm vaccines was quoted as saying "intermediarios" appeared asking for extortionate prices (this is a common form of corruption here especially involving government contracts, for example you pay and recieve a factura for $20 but only $15 reaches the company you are supposedly doing business with as due to some alleged technicality or another you can't buy/import/distribute/fast-track the product without one)
• As we know, AstraZenaca was chosen for purchase by the government largely because it would be produced here in partnership with a private Argentine lab and a private Mexican lab. The purchase is not from AstraZenaca in the UK but the separate and private Argentine lab. The Mexican side is bankrolled by Carlos Slim and the Argentine side by Hugo Sigman - a businessman will well known links to Kirchnerism. His labs were raided in April under court order to search for documentation related to contracts with the government. (I would suspect that IF there was foul play, this one would be more a case of putting money in the hat - you pay me $4, you get $0,20 or something like this... very hard to ever actually prove without knowing who or what you're looking for)
  • This article also states that the government already made a 60% downpayment amounting to around US$54.000.000 despite not reiving any vaccines from them until now
• This week it was announced that Sputnik V would also be produced here by Richmond Labs, another private Argentine lab listed locally. This lab also received government credits to help finance production here that allegedly sent its stock price soaring by 38%. Richmond whose president Marcelo Figueras allegedly has close links with Kirchnerism also and tends to get a good amount of business under them thanks to the Ministry of Health.
• As for Pfizer, even Vizotti admits they never asked for glaciers or did the government ask for bribes. I believe her. Instead the government found some vague legal technicality that the common-man has difficulty comprehending as apparently not even the policymakers can explain it clearly. As a result the government continues to throw its money at the above-mentioned sources.

Usually things just need a little bit of time to start floating to the surface, especially after a feeding-frenzy. At least it should be an entertaining season in the telenovela that is Argentina, whichever way it turns out.

Good information and pretty much what we expect of things here.. clearly not using Pfizer when it has been offered at lower prices to Sinopharm means dodgy dealings. There is no other answer no matter what bullshit the government spreads about law technicalities. The technically is most likely that it's harder to make the money go into the right hands by doing business with Pfizer instead of the Chinese.

 

[Bajo_cero2]

They wanted to be treated as a state actor with liens on state assets.

The issue is that art. 20 of the NC forbids it.

 

[lunar]

Good information and pretty much what we expect of things here.. clearly not using Pfizer when it has been offered at lower prices to Sinopharm means dodgy dealings.

So, Alberto decided not to buy Pfizer for 19.50, but went for Sinopharm for 20 instead? This is terrible! I see "dodgy dealings" written over all the 50 cents of difference.

But seriously, he says Pfizer originally made (unspecified) aggressive demands, and he was not sure they will be able to make the timely shipments, because of their priorities. And it sounds reasonable, in my opinion.

Alberto Fernández: “No quise comprar la vacuna de Pfizer porque me ponía en una situación muy violenta de exigencias”

El Presidente dio una entrevista en Youtube donde dijo que el laboratorio “no quiso firmar el contrato” con la Argentina por sus compromisos con EE.UU.

www.lanacion.com.ar

 

[antipodean]

The demands / dispute with Pfizer appear to be due to wording and guarantees.

Qué se sabe (y qué no) sobre las negociaciones entre el Gobierno nacional y Pfizer

Última actualización: 08/06/2021 En las últimas semanas se produjeron nuevas polémicas en torno a las negociaciones del Gobierno nacional con la empresa farmacéutica estadounidense Pfizer...

chequeado.com

Hardly “violent” unless a party saying they won’t accept X word in a contract is the new definition “violence” in 2021. Especially when the inclusion of said word was a government whim and also adopted a take it or leave it approach.

As for pricing, it was always going to be a mixed bag purchase - the issue I see is instead a matter of where they are choosing to spend their money at the exclusion of other options. There is no argument to say Pfizer is/ was “too expensive” since they are buying others slightly more expensive. Nor does corruption depend on having the highest prices.

The issue with Pfizer-gate in my opinion is that it was a missed opportunity that jeopardized public health and lives. Argentina was at the front of the line to receive them earlier (even if delayed) but instead missed out - meaning for months we lacked vaccines while people died (A few of whom could have been saved by a timely vaccine, whatever vaccine.)

Any enquiry into the failed negotiation with this lab should hopefully examine other government contracts to see how similar issues involving foreign purchases have been dealt with (eg Boeing, Beechcraft etc which generally also require guarantees, US court jurisdiction and similar liability provisions etc.)

 

[lunar]

The issue with Pfizer-gate in my opinion is that it was a missed opportunity that jeopardized public health and lives.

Or may be if Argentina hadn’t signed the deals with Russia and China, it still wouldn’t have received the Pfizer vaccine, or received much less than Russia and China have provided since January. How do you know?

The best COVID-19 vaccine is the one you get.

 

[antipodean]

Or may be if Argentina hadn’t signed the deals with Russia and China, it still wouldn’t have received the Pfizer vaccine, or received much less than Russia and China have provided since January. How do you know?

The best COVID-19 vaccine is the one you get.

That’s my point. Argentina only recently got its AstraZenaca. Why would you put all of your eggs in just a few baskets and exclude millions of other vaccines made available? (E.g. from Pfizer directly, COVAX and now the US donation) More so if you are perusing a mixed-bag strategy that doesn’t depend 100% on any one lab.