Expat Documentary Film

NoPat said:
That's the nutshell of the entire debacle.

That, and the blindingly obvious incapacity of loads of US people that can't see the point, refusing to understand why it can come across as arrogant.

I think the only one making this a debate or debacle is you and a few others who are more than well-known on this board for being "anti-american" anything. I and most other "Americans" from the US made peace with being American a long time ago. I think it's time you should too. The term's not going anywhere anytime soon.
 
LAtoBA said:
I think the only one making this a debate or debacle is you and a few others who are more than well-known on this board for being "anti-american" anything.

Sorry dude, but actually I don't care one way or the other. I use "American" to refer to Usa People myself, believe it or not. I'm hooked on this argument, however, because (a) a very simple point seems incomprehensible to a lot of people, normally US people. And (b) it's less harmful than being hooked on crack (though equal in terms of usefulness and addiction)

If you refer to me as one of the notorious ones here that are "anti-american anything" you'll have a hard time trying to prove it.

If you think I'm anti american for stating the blatantly obvious (i.e. that generally speaking US nationals aren't all that popular abroad and often come across as arrogant) then you need to get out more
 
NoPat said:
Sorry dude, but actually I don't care one way or the other. I use "American" to refer to Usa People myself, believe it or not. I'm hooked on this argument, however, because (a) a very simple point seems incomprehensible to a lot of people, normally US people. And (b) it's less harmful than being hooked on crack (though equal in terms of usefulness and addiction)

You made your point quite clear several times. Forum members also made their points quite clear several times, just as I think it was stated several times that if Latin Americans want to call themselves "American" good for them. I don't remember seeing one single US American "object" to that. Maybe we were looking at two different threads.

That being said it's a hard sell to ask Americans to change how we call ourselves because that is the way we have always called ourselves in English and because it is in our country's name. I've lived in several Latin American countries and I don't ever remember a Latin American taking it to the level that some of the people on this board have taken it. It's borderline ridiculous. And on that note I'm out.
 
As I stated on the other thread, I think the thing I find most amusing is that for all the bitching I hear about the use of the word American, I frequently hear my porteño friends describe someone from the US as americano/a. Nor have I ever heard an Argentine, Mexican/Bolivian/Paraguayan, Colombian, etc use the word to describe his/her own nationality. So despite not using the word themselves as a national identifier & using the word themselves to describe people from the US, it is wrong for someone from the US to use it. :rolleyes:

Back to the original subject, I do think that while there is a story there to look at expats who have chosen to leave the US and create a new life in Argentina, the idea of Argentina as an idyllic haven for expats to settle and create businesses is probably not all that pertinent anymore. I hear of a lot more expats closing up shop (those that have started a business) and returning home than I hear of new business ventures. Back in '05 (my first visit), there was a lot of energy in the air and I met lots of people who were moving here & planning on starting something up. I only know of a few that are still here & have businesses.
 
Its really very silly when threads go so off message and get bogged down by stupid debates about America usa The 49 states (ill be deep deep in the cold cold ground before i reconize misouri) Courtesy of grandpa simpsom.
The question and the debate was, Is the situation in the USA so bad that peopla will leave ???? Is this the beginning of the end of the US empire?????
Is this what it looks like when an empire starts to crumble. Is the USA today just as Argentina was 100 years ago???? The growth has left ....The jobs have left and the wealth is in the hands of the few. What you call an empire when it is in ruins is not really very important. Will the USA reinvent itself ? I doubt it . Its run by the rich and they don't see a problem. And therefore i see a long slow painful Argentine style decline. And will the US military at some point be set upon their own people???? ........
 
NoPat said:
Sorry dude, but actually I don't care one way or the other. I use "American" to refer to Usa People myself, believe it or not. I'm hooked on this argument, however, because (a) a very simple point seems incomprehensible to a lot of people, normally US people. And (b) it's less harmful than being hooked on crack (though equal in terms of usefulness and addiction)

If you refer to me as one of the notorious ones here that are "anti-american anything" you'll have a hard time trying to prove it.

If you think I'm anti american for stating the blatantly obvious (i.e. that generally speaking US nationals aren't all that popular abroad and often come across as arrogant) then you need to get out more


Please would you stop saying USA people? You are only shooting yourself in the foot every time you say that, because you show how ridiculous it sounds to try to find another way to call Americans in English without actually saying the word American. Who would actually refer to Americans as USA people in real conversation?

If English had another word, such as UnitedStatesian, I´d accept your argument. But there is none. Too bad so sad, but American´s it. Take it or leave it. And this has nothing to do with arrogance - I am less proud to be an american than pretty much anyone I know (trust me on this one) but I still disagree that the use of the word as our national identifier indicates an arrogant attitude. Perhaps the country´s forefathers made a really crappy decision when coming up with a name? Shoulda put more thought into that one!

But seriously. Imagine Argentina were located in a region of the Americas called Argentina. Should other citizens of other countries of the region suddenly decide that all argentinians must refer to themselves as ´la gente de la republica de argentina´? That would be equally ridiculous and useless, as it would never happen.
 
windy said:
Its really very silly when threads go so off message and get bogged down by stupid debates about America usa The 49 states (ill be deep deep in the cold cold ground before i reconize misouri) Courtesy of grandpa simpsom.
The question and the debate was, Is the situation in the USA so bad that peopla will leave ???? Is this the beginning of the end of the US empire?????
Is this what it looks like when an empire starts to crumble. Is the USA today just as Argentina was 100 years ago???? The growth has left ....The jobs have left and the wealth is in the hands of the few. What you call an empire when it is in ruins is not really very important. Will the USA reinvent itself ? I doubt it . Its run by the rich and they don't see a problem. And therefore i see a long slow painful Argentine style decline. And will the US military at some point be set upon their own people???? ........

I think this is wrong on several levels and indicates a fundamental misunderstanding of the U.S. The unemployment rate in the U.S. is currently a little under 10% not great but would be considered normal in most countries. It's still a much more dynamic and inventive culture than most and is more flexible and capable of change. The current difficulties besetting the country developed over many years. It will take a few years to recover from the excesses of this period. Income distribution in the U.S. has always been unequal. This is the product of a dynamic capitalist system which for the most part rewards the innovators and risk takers. In the U.S. you get to keep what you make, other cultures believe your earnings should be capped and the excess redistributed to the less fortunate. I think if you look at the history of the world for the last 100 years you will quickly see the American approach produced far greater wealth and a higher standard of living for all compared to other approaches. This is not to say everything is perfect or there aren't problems but relative to other countries they have done very well. To compare the U.S. to Argentina doesn't make much sense. The decline of Argentina is due to intractable political problems not economic fundamentals. I don't think the military will be called out to quell rebellion, the U.S. still has problems, but problems most other countries would like to have.
 
gouchobob said:
Income distribution in the U.S. has always been unequal. This is the product of a dynamic capitalist system which for the most part rewards the innovators and risk takers. In the U.S. you get to keep what you make, other cultures believe your earnings should be capped and the excess redistributed to the less fortunate. I think if you look at the history of the world for the last 100 years you will quickly see the American approach produced far greater wealth and a higher standard of living for all compared to other approaches.

Your assertions are based upon what data?
See http://www.slate.com/id/2266025/entry/2266026:
"In a survey of 27 nations conducted from 1998 to 2001, the country where the highest proportion agreed with the statement "people are rewarded for intelligence and skill" was, of course, the United States. (69 percent). But when it comes to real as opposed to imagined social mobility, surveys find less in the United States than in much of (what we consider) the class-bound Old World. France, Germany, Sweden, Denmark, Spain—not to mention some newer nations like Canada and Australia—are all places where your chances of rising from the bottom are better than they are in the land of Horatio Alger's Ragged Dick."
Many of those countries cited are considerably more socialistic societies than is the US.

Also, see http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/07/opinion/07kristof.html?_r=1 for why the current increase in income disparity in the US is harmful to the country.
For more on the harm of growing and exaggerated income disparity see:
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/14/op...me&ref=general :
The bigger issue is whether the country can afford the systemic damage being done by the ever-growing income inequality between the wealthiest Americans and everyone else, whether poor, middle class or even rich. That burden is inflicted not just on the debt but on the very idea of America — our Horatio Alger faith in social mobility over plutocracy, our belief that our brand of can-do capitalism brings about innovation and growth, and our fundamental sense of fairness. Incredibly, the top 1 percent of Americans now have tax rates a third lower than the same top percentile had in 1970.

...Inequality is instead the result of specific policies, including tax policies, championed by Washington Democrats and Republicans alike as they conducted a bidding war for high-rolling donors in election after election.

...The G.O.P.’s arguments for extending the Bush tax cuts to this crowd[super-rich], usually wrapped in laughably hypocritical whining about “class warfare,” are easily batted down. The most constant refrain is that small-business owners who file in this bracket would be hit so hard they could no longer hire new employees. But the Tax Policy Center found in 2008, when checking out similar campaign claims by “Joe the Plumber,” that only 2 percent of all Americans reporting small-business income, regardless of tax bracket, would see tax increases if Obama fulfilled his pledge to let the Bush tax cuts lapse for the top earners. The economist Dean Baker calculated that the yearly tax increase at the lower end of that bracket, for those with earnings between $200,000 and $500,000, would amount to $700 — which “isn’t enough to hire anyone.”
 
Back
Top