Expats not happy, why stay?

[Italia311]

Spending my time between Italy and Canada....nothing in Argentina suprises me. I actually laugh, because the things here to me are so typical. I totally agree with the love it or leave it attitude but lets be honest...things that happen here...are jokes. My girlfriend (who is argentina) and her family bitch about the same things expats do and they have been here their whole life does it mean they hate argentina? Maybe they just want things to change.

 

[Stanexpat]

There are many shades of colour when moving to a new country and the expat experience is difficult for most. I believe that many come here to escape and glamourise Buenos Aires or Paris or Prague or other similar cities. As commited expats we must educate others in an informed manner . This does not mean that we attack or degrade others for having a different point of view.

The truth is that Argentine people for all their inefficiency, surly service and arrogance are also passionate, fun loving and intelligent. Reading other forums about expats living in Prague, London and Paris the community is much more open in Buenos Aires than most. I know many who moved to Prague and all have told me that Prague is one of the most closed societies fullstop.

I also second the point about cleanliness of Porteño apartments and Porteños .In general apartments are clean and porteños smell nice in even the most unglamourous of moments in Subtes and Buses with 35 degrees of heat outside. Sure there are slobs everywhere but there is a pride in appearance here that is noticeable.

In regards to beach towns and communities there are run down places in the most developed of countries. For many this can be charming and after the super glamour of Carilo and its 10000 dollars a month houses I can understand this.

I also would like to understand why people who leave the country and live elsewhere spend so much time attacking Argentina and seem to me to be happy with every snippet of bad news that is reported about this country. Stan Expat this is directed towards you as I feel that your negative experiences have created resentment to all of us who happen to like Buenos Aires and Argentina.

I'm sorry if my comments are taken as attacking Argentina. I still have many friends there. I wish them and their Argentina home the very best. However, when I see information posted on this site which is obviously incorrect I feel an obligation to the readers to post what I feel is the truth. I might not always be correct but purpose in doing so is not intended to be malicious. I am a frequent critic of the government there which I believe is the main problem in Argentina becoming a successful and wealthy nation.

 

[steveinbsas]

I'm sorry if my comments are taken as attacking Argentina. I still have many friends there. I wish them and their Argentina home the very best. However, when I see information posted on this site which is obviously incorrect I feel an obligation to the readers to post what I feel is the truth. I might not always be correct but purpose in doing so is not intended to be malicious. I am a frequent critic of the government there which I believe is the main problem in Argentina becoming a successful and wealthy nation.

Truth is not a matter of feelings.

 

[HotYogaTeacher]

Hey Italia...
I think that it is hard to walk the line between realistic criticism and bitching. I too would like to see things change, because I think Buenos Aires has the potential to be a great place to live. I have lived in some great places and could register honest complaints about any of them.

For me, the reason I post in response to questions like this is that people need to understand the reality of living in a place like this. It is a big city, bigger than many have lived in before. It is noisy, dirty and expensive. I lived in San Diego on about the same money as I pay to live here. It was quieter, cleaner, prettier (to me) and more polite. There were things I didn't like, but it was a great place to live.

I have had Argentines ask me why I would leave such a place to come here. One said, this place is not a "serious" place, why would you leave a "serious" city like San Diego for this place? My reasons for being here will carry me through hard times. Unlike Stevo I am not retired and not rich and therefor not able to just go to bars and restaurants and meet people at their best.

I have to work, to create an income and have remodeled a home and dealt with much of the difficulty that Argentines deal with. It is often hard and exhausting and saying so is a part of what I give back to other people, because some people helped me.

My own experience, being here with a partner, has been that women alone have it the hardest. They don't understand the culture of dating here and don't, unless they are quite wealthy, have a way to connect with the caliber of men they expect. Interestingly the women who come for the Tango culture are the most disappointed. They were rock stars at home, dancing and having fun, and come here to find that there is a social hiearchy that will require years of learning and climbing just to get to where it is even fun. It is a lonely life because Argentine women their own age are standoffish. I don't presume to know why, but unless you have an "in" it can be hard to make friends with Argie women. They are "friendly" enough, but true friendship is another matter.

Jimmy and I are happy here, but that is because we are happy people. We aren't happy because we're here. We're just happy with ourselves, which would be true anywhere. We look for the joy. I don't see my role on this site that way though. There are plenty of people who will talk Buenos Aires up, I let them take that role and I tell the other side.

If I had to name the things that bother me most, and this is very personal, it is the dirt, on the streets and in the air. I long for fresh air and nature and clean, pretty streets. Even in a bustling cosmopolitan area, in San Diego I was never more than 10 minutes walk from a quiet beautiful place and never more than 30 minutes from the ocean. I miss that.

I also find the rudeness, and saying people in other big cities are rude doesn't change this for me, very hard to get over. I smile and say excuse me politely and don't join in pushing and shoving and continue to make eye contact and to explain politely that I would appreciate it if they wouldn't walk in to me.

The food is tough. I am used to lots of good, fresh, wholesome food in the grocery stores and to being able to spit in any direction and find a great restaurant. I find the food here unappetizing for the most part and I don't like it.

Finally, the lack of easy access to nice things. Being from the states that is something I have really struggled with here. The nicest things from the nicest stores are not nearly the quality we were used to at home and they are costly.

These are the things that are hard and if someone who is considering moving here can live with these things and not be bothered by them then they may be happy here.

I do look forward to going home someday, and in the meanwhile will continue to speak honestly about things in the way I best know how, peacefully. It's funny, my Argentine friends are never insulted by my opinions. Only people like Steve....

Peace...

 

[perry]

Before I moved to Buenos Aires I visited 8 times and stayed for periods of one week to one month. I first came in 1984 in the year of 5000 percent hyperinflation . It certainly was a amazing trip and it created in my mind a pull to this city ever since.

Buenos Aires is a very moody city but one that most who visit never forget. I find all my emotions are amplified here from deep sadness to periods of tremendous happiness. I would never change this experience though as I have learnt more about myself here than anywhere else I have been. I am coming on 4 years now and love Buenos Aires deeper than ever.

This is an interesting link through a new visitors eyes that resonated with me.

http://onalimbonawhim.wordpress.com/2009/02/15/perfecting-the-art-of-life-in-buenos-aires/

 

[steveinbsas]

It's funny, my Argentine friends are never insulted by my opinions. Only people like Steve....Peace...

If you are the cool, hip chick you pretend to be, why did you feel the need to get personal with me?

PS: I wasn't the one insulted by your posts.

Unlike Stevo I am not retired and not rich and therefor not able to just go to bars and restaurants and meet people at their best.

If you ever had a job in sales you might have learned what it means to "assume" anything.

I am neither retired or rich.

I hardly ever go to restaurants except for expat lunches.

And I never go to bars.

Peace and love.

I'm just old enough to say it. I didn't miss the 60's...I was there...

 

[Moxon]

I'm just old enough to say it. I didn't miss the 60's...I was there...

and you remember?

 

[steveinbsas]

and you remember?

Never got into the smoke...

 

[soulskier]

HYT, I am surprised San Diego is cheaper to live the Buenos Aires.

Stanley, I am still waiting for you to come visit me in Patagonia so I can show you how the other half lives.

 

[ms1892]

The truth is that Argentine people for all their inefficiency, surly service and arrogance are also passionate, fun loving and intelligent. Reading other forums about expats living in Prague, London and Paris the community is much more open in Buenos Aires than most. I know many who moved to Prague and all have told me that Prague is one of the most closed societies fullstop.

As a recent arrival to Buenos Aires from Prague in the Czech Republic, i would like to second the remarks Pericles has made about Czech society. It is indeed very closed to expats. There are of course reasons for that. The language barrier for one, is huge. There are many thousands of expats living in Prague who have been there for 10 years or more and still do not speak the language. In addition the communist past does not make for an open and welcoming society. Certainly the friendly attitude of the people here was a major surprise when i arrived.