Feminist Group

[robwerwe]

I´m talking about the difference between the "feel" and the numbers.
Does Argentina have more women in power than in the developed world (minus Sweeden)?
Does Argentina have more female directors than Hollywood?
Does Argentina have more women studying hard sciences and medicine than in the developed world?
Does Argetina have more CEOs that are women than the developed world?

BTW, I used to get a lot of catcalls. 90% were from men over 50, so I think the younger generation has changed. They began to stop when I got older and started wearing ugly clothes. I haven´t heard one in about 4 years. And if you want catcalls to stop, it is quite easy. Women don´t want them to stop.

you are right about the ads, but while they aren´t common in other countries I think it is easier to get a job if you are hot and young in NY. (and the under 30 thing is more about them wanting to pay little).

I´m not saying it is perfect, but I got more catcalls in New York City than in Buenos AIres. When I started my film career in the US I got a long list of jobs I would never get because I was a woman. I have heard a lot of very sexist things in Argentina, but in the reality, the only limit on women here is their own fear.

But we're not talking about Hollywood directors, Politicians or CEOs, we're talking about real people.

 

[DontMindMe]

[background=rgb(255, 255, 255)]


There is a Buenos Aires chapter of Hollaback!: http://buenosaires.ihollaback.org/

I think BA is a city of dichotomies, and the experience of being a woman is no exception. On one hand, I worked for two small businesses run by women and my bosses never faced outright discrimination for being women, occasional comments directed at their appearance and things like that, sure, they told me. But no one doubted their ability to get the job done just for having a vagina. Being a doctor, lawyer, scientist, or entering historically "male" professions does not seem to be a problem, according to what people have told me. (I am not shy in asking about this stuff; it interests me.) There's a female president, etc. etc.

But then you have your day-to-day social stuff, just existing in the world. That's where I found BA to be an extremely difficult place to live. It wears on you after a while. My personal theory is that Mediterranean machismo combined with Latin American machismo to make a particularly foul brand of machismo that I've honestly never found anywhere else in all my time traveling and living abroad in places known for having machista cultures. (I have spent a month to years in Peru, Italy, Spain, Argentina, Mexico, Colombia--this list doesn't include shorter trips to several other Latin American countries.)

Comments on the street telling you you're pretty are one thing, but I don't take them as a compliment because it comes from the same place as the crude ones (which are the majority)-- a sense of ownership over women's bodies, a right to comment on a strange woman's body as if it were public property. These men have no desire to have a conversation with the women they shout at. Try it next time--stop walking and look at them. They tend to just blink at you, shocked. I've written several posts about treatment by doctors, gropings, sexual assault, etc. so I won't bother here. Needless to say it happens a lot. A lot. Gringoboy, I can't help but wonder how your lady will feel when she ages more and stops receiving comments. She was raised to view piropos as compliments in a society where women are still valued more for their physical beauty than anything else.

"In the documentary we interviewed Victor Hugo and he had a great quote:
'Who said that machismo is a tool used by men to opress women? Many of the largest proponents of machismo are women. Machismo is a system of discrimination that has as many male as female victims.'"

What a f*cking idiot. He really could have expressed himself better. Machismo negatively affects men as well as women, very true, but not nearly to the same extent.The older male posters on this forum are swimming in it with all their boasting, sure, and it's pretty sad that they feel the need to brag so much about their younger GFs and all that. (News flash guys, nobody cares.) We've ALL been brainwashed by thousands of years of a patriarchal society. Twisting it around and acting like women consciously promote machismo is some of the dumbest sh*it I have ever read.


If you want the catcalls to stop, they will??? Arghhhh I really think 10 years in Argentina has gotten to you. I started wearing nothing but loose jeans and baggy t-shirts, I never wore makeup during the day, I stopped wearing my hear down, I grew out my highlights, I tried all kinds of shit. I though the 15 pounds of depression weight I gained would at least get the street harrasment to stop. Nope. I thought, God, I can't wait till I hit 30 or so and this stops, because nothing else works. Nothing. The women who like the piropos were raised to value their physical beauty above all else. Sad to see another woman who seems to have jumped on the blame-the-women bandwagon. Nothing will improve if we don't work together. Christ. [/background]

 

[Inferno.]

ahahha do you live in the real world?

Have you seen the adverts asking for you to be a woman and under 30??? That would be illegal in many other countries, not here!
As soon as my blonde flat mate walks down the street she gets called names.
My girlfriend often gets 'touch' on the bus and subte, this rarely happens in developed countries.
There is a general macho culture here if that hasn't passed you by.

Perhaps you've lived here too long and just become used to it.

I have to disagree with you. I think your are mixing things. That behavior is not "gender discrimination" nor gender abuse. You can and may think of that as rude, an insult, a compliment, an ego booster, they way you want to percieve that. The point that I'm trying to make is that there is a difference between the culture of a country and a real abuse to women. I have to say that I don't see that here (and I say it as a male born here). In real life, with real people. What can't you do as a woman in argentina? Aren't you able to go to college? To practice some profession? to work in some company? to be the owner of a place? To play some sport? I'm seeing women in every position, in every place.

I would love to read what women can't achieve in this country because they are being discriminated for their gender.

 

[Ceviche]

I always give a whistle when I see a beautiful girl passing by. Sometimes, they ignore me and sometimes they give a smile or a blush. Am I being rude to them?

 

[medialuna989]

I'm possibly interested in such a group! Esp. interested in women & development issues

 

[robwerwe]

http://www.argentinaindependent.com/socialissues/urbanlife/abuse-at-home-violence-against-women-in-argentina/#hide

 

[medialuna989]

[font=Helvetica Neue'][background=rgb(255, 255, 255)]If you want the catcalls to stop, they will??? Arghhhh I really think 10 years in Argentina has gotten to you. I started wearing nothing but loose jeans and baggy t-shirts, I never wore makeup during the day, I stopped wearing my hear down, I grew out my highlights, I tried all kinds of shit. I though the 15 pounds of depression weight I gained would at least get the street harrasment to stop. Nope. I thought, God, I can't wait till I hit 30 or so and this stops, because nothing else works. Nothing. The women who like the piropos were raised to value their physical beauty above all else. Sad to see another woman who seems to have jumped on the blame-the-women bandwagon. Nothing will improve if we don't work together. Christ. [/background][/font]

To add on - the behavior towards women on the street is something that you're immediately exposed to in BsAs ... catcalls, unabashed staring, and groping are all accepted. In other countries I've lived, especially for unwanted touching on the street or collectivo, women tended to lend support/disapproval/confrontation. That's almost nil here.

 

[PhilipDT]

The president is a woman,

Oh please! Yes in Argentina, women can and have become president, the small catch is of course that first they have to be married to a male president!

 

[Yogur griego]

I always give a whistle when I see a beautiful girl passing by. Sometimes, they ignore me and sometimes they give a smile or a blush. Am I being rude to them?

I clicked on this thread and correctly predicted this reply.

 

[Yogur griego]

Very interesting discussion, people, at least the actual foreigners here disagree about something.