Landlady claiming rent transfer did not go through

[TheBlackHand]

Yes. The money never got to the property owners account. It is in limbo until BOTH the sender and receiver provide information to the central bank regarding the source of the funds and the reason behind the wire transfer. And then the Central bank can still retain up to 30% of these funds for up to a year and take their sweet time in releasing the balance of the funds.

There is NO way whatsoever for the owner to get the funds unless the sender submits paperwork to the BCRA which then goes to AFIP and then they will either release or return the funds.

If the sender doesn't provide this information within reasonable time, the property owners bank will instruct the Central Bank to return the funds to it's place of origin. And then that receipt will have no validity in Argentina since both AFIP and the BCRA will have first hand knowledge and documentation that the transaction was never completed because both the sender and receiver didn't provide the proper information.

If the sender doesn't send the pertinent financial information to the receiver and or her banking " agent " then the transaction can't be completed, and the rent will still be owed.

Someone once bought something from me and tried to pay me via international transfer since it was a considerable amount of money. For about 3 weeks he swore up and down he sent it but when I finally called the bank since it was never credited into my account, the bank told me the sender and I had to provide financial information for the transaction to go through since the central bank was retaining it. And if not, it would either sit in the central bank or get returned since the sender never gave me the documents needed to complete the transfer. In the end the sender decided it was easier to pay me in cash instead of us both having to deal with AFIP, BCRA and the whole tedious process.

That was the first experience that taught me that Argentinian banks accounts are pretty much worthless outside of Argentina, and even then..........

In the end the wire was returned, I was paid in cash, the sender received his purchased goods and all was well. Similar situation, different people, different attitudes, different scruples, different results. Go figure.

All foreign wire transfers go through the Argentine Central Bank: middle man.
Getting them to release the funds could be where the problem is? Just a thought.

 

[Crema Americana]

And if not, it would either sit in the central bank or get returned since the sender never gave me the documents needed to complete the transfer. In the end the sender decided it was easier to pay me in cash instead of us both having to deal with AFIP, BCRA and the whole tedious process.

That's all fine and good, but how do you "decide" that? Is there a way to cancel an international transfer while it's still in limbo? Because I'm sure the OP doesn't want to have to pay in cash and have 3 months rent money lost in Argentina's banksphere. Strangely enough it reminds me of the mail system.

 

[ndcj]

In the end the wire was returned, I was paid in cash, the sender received his purchased goods and all was well. Similar situation, different people, different attitudes, different scruples, different results. Go figure.

The OP's wire hasn't been returned (so he is out the money right now) and by the sounds of it, the landlady hasn't asked him to provide any documents. Of course if the funds are returned to the OP, then he has an obligation to pay her again, at her expense (ie. paying for a new wire, or other transfer method).

Most transfer "códigos" don't need any information from the sender, and anyway, it's not up to the OP to have even a passing familiarity with these requirements.

The codigo for this operation I think is 347 - Otras rentas cobradas del exterior. It needs the sender's bank account number, bank name and the sender's name (the latter two appear in the SWIFT message) to be completed in the DDJJ by the recipient. Nothing else.

If the OP said "the landlady asked for my account number to comply with the BCRA's requirements to release the funds and I don't want to give it to her, nor pay her some other way" then you might have a point. Instead, you don't.

 

[el_expatriado]

What a pain... int'l wire transfers and dealing with the BCRA and AFIP just to pay your rent?

If I was a landlord I would never have agreed to this. You really just need to find a way to get cash to your landlady.

Argentina has capital controls, hello?!?! They only people who should be dealing with wire transfers are businesses that are importing and exporting.

 

[TheBlackHand]

Yes, there is a way to cancel it. You speak to the head of the bank and request that the wire be reversed and he speaks to the BCRA and they cancel the transaction for lack of proper documentation. That's what I did. The sender had his money back in a couple days and one week later he paid in cash. But then again we were both trying to do the right thing by each other and neither of us tried to leave the other person hanging. We were just trying to complete a simple transaction that didn't need to be complicated by involving two international banks, Argentina's central bank and the afip.

But then again every one is different I guess.

That's all fine and good, but how do you "decide" that? Is there a way to cancel an international transfer while it's still in limbo? Because I'm sure the OP doesn't want to have to pay in cash and have 3 months rent money lost in Argentina's banksphere. Strangely enough it reminds me of the mail system.

 

[TheBlackHand]

The " op " said what was convenient for him to say on a anonymous public forum. And as to your personal opinions about me having a " point " or not. You're entitled to them. But if you really think it's as easy as simply providing the senders bank account number and name, something the receiving bank already has then you obviously haven't done this transaction recently.

So tell me again, how's it working out pretending to know everything ?

If the OP said "the landlady asked for my account number to comply with the BCRA's requirements to release the funds and I don't want to give it to her, nor pay her some other way" then you might have a point. Instead, you don't.

 

[TheBlackHand]

Yeah basically. But then again anything to save a few bucks egh. Especially when someone else has to lose money and time for your personal benefit.

I really feel bad for the owner in all of this. It sounds like she did everything to try to accommodate this person and help him out. Things most intelligent landlords wouldn't do and now that she needs help this person is repaying her by telling her to go pound sand with AFIP and the BCRA for the next month just so she can get paid for an apartment he is already occupying.

What a pain... int'l wire transfers and dealing with the BCRA and AFIP just to pay your rent?

If I was a landlord I would never have agreed to this. You really just need to find a way to get cash to your landlady.

Argentina has capital controls, hello?!?! They only people who should be dealing with wire transfers are businesses that are importing and exporting.

 

[ndcj]

The " op " said what was convenient for him to say on a anonymous public forum. And as to your personal opinions about me having a " point " or not. You're entitled to them. But if you really think it's as easy as simply providing the senders bank account number and name, something the receiving bank already has then you obviously haven't done this transaction recently.

So tell me again, how's it working out pretending to know everything ?

OK, I'll bite. When is the last time you received a wire transfer into an Argentine bank account for that codigo? Each different codigo has different requirements.

Transactions involving "capital" related codigos, like the correct code for settling a purchase like you described, have much more detailed requirements.

Go and ask in your bank what paperwork they need for the BCRA to release a transfer under codigo 347 and let us know how wrong I am!

The OP said the landlady says the transfer "didn't go through". If it didn't go through for whatever reason and the landlady asked the bank to return the transfer, then the OP would have the money back, especially after initiating a trace. Apparently his bank says they have disbursed the money. Obviously until the landlady asks him for some documentation or he gets the money back, it's not at all his problem.

Of course, you could be right, and he may be posting completely inaccurate facts and half truths because this is an anonymous forum. Has nothing to do with the advice given for the set of facts presented, which is that it is, so far, a problem for his landlady to chase up with her bank.

 

[ndcj]

Yes, there is a way to cancel it. You speak to the head of the bank and request that the wire be reversed and he speaks to the BCRA and they cancel the transaction for lack of proper documentation. That's what I did.

Right, this is the prerogative of the RECIPIENT. The OP cannot do it.

If he gets the money back into his foreign account, of course he has a responsibility to make good again on the payment, but at the official rate that she agreed to when she accepted the wire transfer, and with any additional costs for another transfer method at the landlady's expense.

 

[el_expatriado]

It would have been easier to just go and get the money out of an ATM and give it to the landlady. I can just imagine the scene... this poor little 60 year old lady going to the bank talking about "codigos" and trying to present paperwork and letters to the central bank trying to release the transfer.

What a pain, and for nothing.