Nestor Kirchner has just passed

[nativexpat]

Guys.. let's not get into this "Menem vs. Nestor" debate ... please...

 

[SaraSara]

But seriously Sara, when you post such absurdities, do you know they are demonstrably false when you are saying them, or do you genuinely believe them and if so how do you arrive at such spectacular conclusions - are these things people tell you? do you have mystical insights after a little too much Hellmann's mayonnaise? is it a faulty app on your i phone?

I long ago gave up taking an interest in your posts from a parallel universe as you simply ignore anyone who questions the veracity of what you post and move on to the next absurdity. But apologies Sara, I am weak, I could not let that go past. An Argentine who is unaware that the media law was passed by congress, it just beggars belief.

The "Ley de Medios" has not fully passed - it has only half sanction. I urge you to read the paper more closely. That is, if you are fluent in Spanish.

Some expats live in a kind of private bubble - the country see and talk about has no resemblance to the Argentina the locals live in. But by all means, keep on dreaming...!

Yesterday I was talking to an expat who dropped out of this forum because of the kind of posters it attracts. Apparently, it has the reputation of being the reduct of some very aggressive posters. Right now I don't feel inclined to disagree with him.

Now, Moxon, as a personal favor, please go back to ignoring my posts. Just in case you don't know it, there's a very useful "ignore" function in this board - with a little effort I'm sure you can activate it, and then you'll be rid of me FOREVER.

Now, isn't that an attractive prospect?

 

[Moxon]

I disagree. If Menem had not privatized the utilities this expat group wouldn't exist. I was in Argentina in the early 90's. The infrastructure was a nightmare. Making a phone call a few blocks away could take half an hour. You had to call over and over. There used to be regular power cuts. You had to wait several years to get a phone installed. Yes, there was corruption in the transfer to private ownership but I doubt that there was more than now. It's popular to blame Menem for everything but how many would like to go back to living without phones or basic, working amenities?

The phones, yes people always mention the phones - yes thankyou Carlos for fixing the phones - a purely accidental outcome in the massive transfer of public assets to the private sphere at fire sale prices (and the attendant greasing of palms, co-option of many unions turning their leaders into shareholders and enforcers for the companies themselves etc) to raise the foreign currency in order to squeeze a bit more life out of the convertibility plan. Yes but apart from those little things and apart from the death of the railways in this process and apart from the airlines, the pensions (which shaved over a percentage point off GDP and acclerated the descent) and apart from the threats, beatings and killings of journalists, apart from the other deaths, mysterious accidents, 'suicides', the exploding arms dumps, the gun running, the ferrari (mine, mine, mine!), changing the constitution to be re-elected, the automatic majority he installed, the chief of customs who couldn't speak Spanish, the amnesty for the perpetrators of the human rights abuses of the dictatorship, the decrees (how many was it 400? 500?), and apart from the decimation of Argentine industry, the resultant unemployment (and crime, significantly higher than it is now) the inevitable default and massive economic repercussions as a result of his policies, apart from all that (and excuse my terrible memory, I know I've left things out) I guess, yes, he wasn't so bad really.

 

[marksoc]

Well, luckily most of the country has a different opinion of K that the people (some of them illegal immigrants, I believe) that post here. If Cristina whishes to be president again,she will win. Eat your heart, cipayos.

 

[perry]

For all the people who critisize the presidential dynasty of the Kirchners can they seriously say that Buenos Aires and Argentina is not much better off today than 10 years ago ? The country from 1970 to 2000 lurched from one disaster to another from military dictatorship to hyperinflation of 5000 percent to the Menem years and his terrible policies of privatising argentinian industries and then the crash of 2000 that decimated a people and country.

You are living in a state of denial if you cannot accept that Argentina in 2010 is much better than it has been for a very long time.

 

[Vikingo]

The "Ley de Medios" has not fully passed - it has only half sanction. I urge you to read the paper more closely. That is, if you are fluent in Spanish.

Some expats live in a kind of private bubble - the country see and talk about has no resemblance to the Argentina the locals live in. But by all means, keep on dreaming...!

Yesterday I was talking to an expat who dropped out of this forum because of the kind of posters it attracts. Apparently, it has the reputation of being the reduct of some very aggressive posters. Right now I don't feel inclined to disagree with him.

Now, Moxon, as a personal favor, please go back to ignoring my posts. Just in case you don't know it, there's a very useful "ignore" function in this board - with a little effort I'm sure you can activate it, and then you'll be rid of me FOREVER.

Now, isn't that an attractive prospect?

Some expats live in a kind of private bubble ??? And what about you???

What´s what you don´t like about la ley de medios?? Tell me because I can´t understand you, it looks like you repeat what Clarin and La Nacion say. You don´t have a reason to oppose it.

They are trying to implement la ley de ganancias which will distribute the 10% of the companies profits among their employees? Do you also oppose to that right?

And please, aside from the corruption and favoritism of the K, what are the measures he/she took you dislike?

What´s your ideal of government? Hitler, Videla, Mussolini, Bush??

 

[SaraSara]

Sadly, I disagree. The corruption will likely be transferred to the next administration. As corrupt as the K's have been, they are mere amateurs compared to Menem. Who knows what new heights of corruption the next administration might scale.

Please note I said HALF the corruption would likely vanish - the new administration will probably be corrupt too, but will have to start building its own corruption network from scratch.

As for Menem's corruption, I was not in Argentina at that time and don't know much about his regime. From what I know, he stole the country blind but did not tangle with the institutions. He did not eviscerate INDEC, nor did he appropriate the Central Bank's and Anses' reserves.

But as I said, I don't know much about Menem's administration. If someone was here at the time, I'd appreciate hearing more about his government.

 

[dr__dawggy]

Guys.. let's not get into this "Menem vs. Nestor" debate ... please...

Sorry, the point I was trying to make in my original post about Menem was that corruption did not begin with Nestor and will not end with his death not to compare the two..... Corruption is an institutionalized art form in government at all levels in Argentina, from payments to individual policemen in lieu of receiving a ticket to presidents who take hundreds of millions from the public treasury.

 

[citygirl]

The interesting thing is that the anti-K commentary here has been downright tame compared to what many porteño friends and conocidos are posting on facebook, twitter, etc.

I think it's safe to say that anti-K sentiment isn't just an expat thing.

 

[nativexpat]

You are living in a state of denial if you cannot accept that Argentina in 2010 is much better than it has been for a very long time.

Perry, no offense, but....... did you grow up in Argentina? Are your parents retired in Argentina? Do you send your kids to school in Argentina? How long have you lived here?

I don't blame the K's for everything, that's for sure. We have the country we deserve to have.