Occupy Wallstreet... and Bs As?

[mariposa]

They need to do their complaining at the voting booth, not out on the streets.

Punk Rock Stars, you are either kidding, or you are incredibly naive. Elections are no longer decided by voters but by big money (thank you, u.s. surpeme court!), and politicians are owned by the big donors, including (alas) obama. hence, to the streets. about time.

 

[starlucia]

They need to do their complaining at the voting booth, not out on the streets. Funny thing is, these are probably the same people that voted the current administration in office.

The Tea Partyers did it right. Organizing a grass roots effort and moving forward with their support.

Hee. I mean this in the gentlest tone possible, but this just sounds so... Anglo ("we must organize a coherent demonstration at all previously-confirmed protest sites.") I was watching the protesters in Madrid this summer, shaking my head and thinking, "What is wrong with us? Our country has been just as screwed up, if not more, as any one in the Eurozone, yet we

never

get our asses out there to be heard." We bitch on the Internet, watch The Daily Show and the network talking heads, e-mail each other the latest NYT columns and tell each other to POST THIS ON YOUR FB WALL IF YOU'VE HAD ENOUGH, but that's about the extent of our ganas. Sure, maybe these protests won't lead to actual legislative reform, but they're a symbolic turning point and I'm glad to see Americans finally showing some signs of life (and emotion.)

 

[dr__dawggy]

You've been watching the mainstream media if you think this protest is about any one thing in particular. Some protests have a list of "demands," which I think are pretty reasonable: healthcare, education, jobs, etc. But if you've followed these protests on YouTube or even via their live stream, you would know that MSNBC is incorrect in suggesting that everyone out there hates capitalism, and that FOX News is incorrect in suggesting that everyone out there is a socialist at best, a communist at worst.

The fact is that you have all sorts of groups out there. There are labor unions, people who support free market capitalism, people who think we need more "social justice", and then you have people like myself who think we need a new system all together. The mainstream media is going to twist this to fit their agenda, as they always manage to do.

We're the only species on this planet that has to pay (monetarily) to live on this planet. Think about that. This is just the beginning.

While the Occupy Wall Street protests may have attracted many of the alienated groups you mention, one needn't go to Fox to deduce that the leadership is from the left wing:
The list of demands from their web site reads like a workers of the world unite manifesto...
http://occupywallst.org/forum/proposed-list-of-demands-for-occupy-wall-st-moveme/

 

[sesamosinsal]

Yeah, this guy is a total left-winger.

 

[jp]

They need to do their complaining at the voting booth, not out on the streets.

If they chose to follow that route, there would never be any change at all. Where would change come from? Would politicians just start randomly taking on causes, hoping that the public might like one and vote for them?

If enough people protest, and even more sympathise - the cause of the protesters will be taken up by a politician looking to make a career / win votes / actually do something. And then they can vote for them in the ballot box. Then who knows? Something might actually happen. It has before...

 

[sesamosinsal]

Complaining at the voting booth? That's hilarious. Our votes are bought. The corporate-run media and the million-dollar PACs buy them. Your vote is a return on someone's investment.

How do presidential candidates make it to the spotlight in the first place? I had to laugh at the requirement's mentioned for one of the FOX News debates. The anchor said that the candidates had to least get 3 percent of the vote in order to participate in the debate. Where did the people who voted find out about the candidates in the first place? How did anyone ever learn about Herman Cain, for example? I had never heard of him until he appeared on FOX News. What about Barack Obama? He was a liberal media darling! Everyone says, "Oh, the media doesn't affect me," but study after study (and reality) indicates the complete opposite.

Voting gives us the illusion that we're in control, but, in reality, money controls everything. So, if I have a vote and no money, what control do I have? Where is President Obama going to get his $1 BILLION for the next presidential campaign? Wake up, folks.

 

[PhilipDT]

Many there believe that the old left/right conflict is being used as a tool to keep the masses diverted with fighting over the scraps while the top one percent continue their looting.

Oh the irony.


Social upheaval is a great way to for those with money to make more.

Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.

- Reform the journalism/media sector : no more ties, ever, with the financial world, please..

This sounds really nice. As do a few of French Jurists other points. The problem with them is this: The alternative to private ownership is government ownership, and all you have to do is look to any country with only state run media to see the problem there..

Overall I think that the system we have in the First World is pretty damn good. Not perfect mind you, we most certainly need some tweaks but radical change and the upending of the system is no the answer. Neoliberalism tempered by governmental protections and controls is not a perfect system, a perfect system will never exist, but its the closest thing to it.

 

[dr__dawggy]

Yeah, this guy is a total left-winger.

Like I posted above, the movement has certainly attracted a wider group of dissatisfied protesters....but the leadership of the group has a leftist agenda, per their web site.

fwiw, I agree with the guy you linked. I liked him.....I will sign on if he forms his own protest group.

 

[gsi16386]

I think it's safe to say that the people on this forum are 99% to the left and liberal, and I certainly respect that. However, it seems as if you all are suggesting a complete overhaul of the political system. No more voting? that doesn't count anymore? What would you all suggest as a solution...Taking to the streets in anarchy? Fantastic...that's why they will not be taken seriously.

I believe in free speech and protest, but not doing it in the middle of the streets like a bunch of spoiled teenagers that didn't get what they wanted. They're affecting others around them whom may think differently and might be going to work and that's not what the US was founded upon. Everyone has the right to their own opinion and they have the right to express that opinion, but with order and respect. That's what seperates us from the rest of the world...

As far as politicians being bought, certainly corporations donate money to lobby their positions on certain regulatory issues, but they can't buy votes, only influence positions. It's up to the great minds of the people to vote candidates in. The media certainly influences which candidates will be up for election, but as long as they're 35yrs old, anyone can run for office. Why don't YOU start a grass roots effort and elect someone you like? With the advent of internet media anything is possible nowadays.

 

[steveinbsas]

I think it's safe to say that the people on this forum are 99% to the left and liberal, and I certainly respect that. However, it seems as if you all are suggesting a complete overhaul of the political system. No more voting? that doesn't count anymore? What would you all suggest as a solution...Taking to the streets in anarchy? Fantastic...that's why they will not be taken seriously.

I believe in free speech and protest, but not doing it in the middle of the streets like a bunch of spoiled teenagers that didn't get what they wanted. They're affecting others around them whom may think differently and might be going to work and that's not what the US was founded upon. Everyone has the right to their own opinion and they have the right to express that opinion, but with order and respect. That's what seperates us from the rest of the world...

As far as politicians being bought, certainly corporations donate money to lobby their positions on certain regulatory issues, but they can't buy votes, only influence positions. It's up to the great minds of the people to vote candidates in. The media certainly influences which candidates will be up for election, but as long as they're 35yrs old, anyone can run for office. Why don't YOU start a grass roots effort and elect someone you like? With the advent of internet media anything is possible nowadays.

I like this post, but just want to point out that the 35 years of age requirement only applies to the presidency. US Senators and members of the House of Representatives only need to have reached the age of 30 and 25. The age requirement for many state and local offices is even lower.

Article 1, Section 2 0f the US Constitution:

No Person shall be a Representative who shall not have attained to the Age of twenty five Years, and been seven Years a Citizen of the United States, and who shall not, when elected, be an Inhabitant of that State in which he shall be chosen.

Article 1, Section 3 of the US Constitution:

No Person shall be a Senator who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty Years, and been nine Years a Citizen of the United States, and who shall not, when elected, be an Inhabitant of that State for which he shall be chosen.


Article 2, Section 1 of the US Constitution:

No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States.