Overstaying 90-day limit

ratkorga

Registered
Hello all! I've read this whole thread and yet still unclear on a few points.

What's clear: I've overstayed more than 4 years so my fine will be 15,000 pesos. Wow, Fair enough.

Unclear:

Passport was stolen, replaced, so no entry stamp. How does this complicate things?

I'm not in CABA and don't plan on going back, would rather not. So won't be leaving via EZE but probably bus because I'll have little after the fine.

I see I can pay the fine in other places: Sede Central o en cualquier Delegación de esta Dirección Nacional en el Interior del País. So that's fine.

But I see warnings here not to go to Migraciones because they could detain me, even though I was there to pay the fine?

So it's better/safer to leave via EZE?

Bit confused on these points. Thanks.
 

steveinbsas

Registered
I've overstayed more than 4 years so my fine will be 15,000 pesos.

Passport was stolen, replaced, so no entry stamp. How does this complicate things?
If you can't prove the date of entry the fine is $15.000 pesos, even of the overstay was by only four weeks.

I'm not in CABA and don't plan on going back, would rather not. So won't be leaving via EZE but probably bus because I'll have little after the fine.
If you have no desire to return to Argentina and you have no desire to pay the fine, it's undoubtedly better to leave at a border crossing where you will be allowed to leave without paying (see post #137 in this thread).

I see I can pay the fine in other places: Sede Central o en cualquier Delegación de esta Dirección Nacional en el Interior del País. So that's fine.

But I see warnings here not to go to Migraciones because they could detain me, even though I was there to pay the fine?
IMO you should not go to migraciones, especially If you don't want to pay the fine.

So it's better/safer to leave via EZE?
Unless there is an official way for them to do so, the airline "should not" allow you to check in without paying the fine.

Based on a post made about a year ago, one expat who had overstayed was allowed to check in without paying the fine. He was allowed to leave but only after being grilled by migraciones as he went to the departure gate. He was told (or later discovered on line) that his fine increased to the maximum of $15.000 pesos and the airline was (according to him) fined $300.000 pesos.

PS: Others (especially Argentine attorneys) are encouraged to add to or correct anything in this post.
 

ratkorga

Registered
T
If you can't prove the date of entry the fine is $15.000 pesos, even of the overstay was by only four weeks.



If you have no desire to return to Argentina and you have no desire to pay the fine, it's undoubtedly better to leave at a border crossing where you will be allowed to leave without paying (see post #137 in this thread).



IMO you should not go to migraciones, especially If you don't want to pay the fine.



Unless there is an official way for them to do so, the airline "should not" allow you to check in without paying the fine.

Based on a post made about a year ago, one expat who had overstayed was allowed to check in without paying the fine. He was allowed to leave but only after being grilled by migraciones as he went to the departure gate. He was told (or later discovered on line) that his fine increased to the maximum of $15.000 pesos and the airline was (according to him) fined $300.000 pesos.

PS: Others (especially Argentine attorneys) are encouraged to add to or correct anything in this post.
Thanks for replying. I had sort of resigned myself to having to pay the fine but really I just want the quickest, easiest exit.

Iguazu is not really an option as an exit for me as I thought I need a visa for Brazil.

So I'm not sure what other similar border crossings there are.
If you can't prove the date of entry the fine is $15.000 pesos, even of the overstay was by only four weeks.



If you have no desire to return to Argentina and you have no desire to pay the fine, it's undoubtedly better to leave at a border crossing where you will be allowed to leave without paying (see post #137 in this thread).



IMO you should not go to migraciones, especially If you don't want to pay the fine.



Unless there is an official way for them to do so, the airline "should not" allow you to check in without paying the fine.

Based on a post made about a year ago, one expat who had overstayed was allowed to check in without paying the fine. He was allowed to leave but only after being grilled by migraciones as he went to the departure gate. He was told (or later discovered on line) that his fine increased to the maximum of $15.000 pesos and the airline was (according to him) fined $300.000 pesos.

PS: Others (especially Argentine attorneys) are encouraged to add to or correct anything in this post.
 

Andyl

Registered
Can you upload a picture without your personal info?
My friend has read and she said there's really nothing import on there. It gives you a code to login and then the details are there.
So I went back to the border and explained my situation and that I was lied to and wasn't given the option to go back to town to pay the correct fee. Typical response. Not my problem and we can't change it. So I ended up just walking through the border. I have my bag. Now I just need to get back out
 

steveinbsas

Registered
There was no price on there. I just assumed it was 4500 for over staying. But instead they put me in the category of leaving without paying. Which isn't right.
"They" (migraciones) did not put you in the category of leaving without paying. The act of leaving without paying (based on an erroneous assumption) did that.

...I went back to the border and explained my situation and that I was lied to and wasn't given the option to go back to town to pay the correct fee. Typical response. Not my problem and we can't change it.
You apparently think you are the victim here and I have to agree that you are. You are a victim of your erroneous assumptions of the details of the laws governing the tourist visa. It isn't the responsibility of any border agent to explain your options or the details of the law. It is the responsibility of every tourist in a foreign country to know the rules and regulations (aka laws) governing their visa.

Just because the first official did not tell you the fee/fine would increase from $4.500 to $15.000 pesos if you left without paying doesn't mean you were lied to, unless that official actually told you that the fine would still be $4500 pesos if you paid on line after leaving. I seriously doubt you would have been "lied to" if you had asked the appropriate questions about the fees, and I'm reasonably certain that you still had the (legal) option to "go back to town to pay the correct fee" before you left without paying, even if the official never told you that you did..

So I ended up just walking through the border. I have my bag. Now I just need to get back out
You just walked trough the border, reentering Argentina without going through migraciones and without paying the prior $15.000 overstay fee? Do you have any idea what the consequences of that action might be?

I am not an expert on the law, but I can think of the following possibilities at this point:

1. You are allowed to leave without paying the original $15.000 pesos overstay fee.

2. You are allowed to leave after paying the original overstay fee of $15.000 pesos.

3. You are allowed to leave after paying the original overstay fee of $15.000 pesos plus an additional fee/fine of $15.000 pesos for not having an entry stamp that follows your recent exit stamp.

4. You are detained and then deported without paying a fine with a multiple year ban on your return.

5. You are detained and then deported after paying a fine with a multiple year ban on your return.

6. You are detained, charged, and prosecuted.

Hopefully, Dr. Rubilar (Bajo_cero2) will read this. Perhaps he can advise you how you might be able to leave, with or without paying the fine(s) and/or without being detained (if that is actually a possibility at this point).

PS: I sincerely hope you have already been able to leave the country without difficulty, but if you haven't yet done so, I urge you to wait for Dr. Rubliar's response before attempting your final exit, as I fear that just "walking though the border" could be considered a more serious offense than an overstay.
 
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Andyl

Registered
Thanks for replying stevin. Might I add it's very well structured an straight to your point. 10/10
Yes I made it back over the border. Here's me thinking all those hours of online tactical games would never come in handy. How wrong was I!
I spent 3 unsuccessful hours on the phone trying to speak to someone, as well as many sent emails. Unfortunately to no avail. My Argentine friends laughed and said good luck with that!
I will try again tomorrow as I would like to get it sorted.
 

ratkorga

Registered
Sorry to ask again and belabor the points...

I've seen at least three warnings not to go to migraciones, even to pay the overstay fee, which in my case, with no entry stamp, will be 15,000.

Although I'd love to keep that 332 USD in my pocket, I have no desire to be deported or detained and will gladly pay if it prevents that. But it might be inevitable, even if I pay the fee? They can deport me and make me pay the fee.

You suggested to leave through a border crossing where I will be allowed to leave without paying the fee. Maybe that's a AR/Chile border crossing? No one seems to leave by bus in these threads. What happens at these crossings? No one knows.

I'm not returning to Argentina, btw.

That's assuming that a company will sell me a ticket and/or let me onboard a bus that crosses the border if I don't have an entry stamp. That seems unlikely that they'll let me.

If you have no desire to return to Argentina and you have no desire to pay the fine, it's undoubtedly better to leave at a border crossing where you will be allowed to leave without paying (see post #137 in this thread).

IMO you should not go to migraciones, especially If you don't want to pay the fine.
 

Bajo_cero2

Registered
They check you identity using name and day of birth. No problem about the lost passport. Just pay the fine before you leave.
 
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