Re: Expats And Politics - Expressing Opinions Publicly

Here you are confuse about how law works.

The limit of freedom of speach is the prohibition of incitement to racial hatred (Ariel81).

There are always limits to rights.

Nope not confused. I'm well aware that law can be used to censor. That's what I'm talking about. You're confused about the meaning of "free speech." Deciding that "racissm" is illegal is no different than deciding that blasphemy is illegal or questioning the govt. is illegal. You're probably "confused" and think you can arbitrarily decide what is the "limit" of free speech based on content because you never read any of the original arguments for free speech in people like Mill.

Good job aping the speaking patterns of USA journalists though, "you're confused," etc. ...what a pompous donkey.
 
"Sticks and stones may break my bones; but words will never hurt me."

Freedom of speech means no limit to speech. That doesn't mean that there should be no consequences for speech, for example, that urges violence - if violence is a result of that speech. And if that violence happens, the speaker should be addressed as makes sense for each case related to possible consequences of the effects of that speech, right along with the perpetrators of the violence itself.

You can't legislate goodwill toward your fellow man - but you can legislate consequences when less-than-good-will turns to violence.

The over-riding principle should be, in my opinion, that people have a duty to themselves and those around them not to physically or mentally harm others without a need for self-defense. If you try to stop a future crime by limiting what people can say, you are in effect punishing people before a crime has been committed by removing rights of exp<b></b>ression. If that is the goal and everyone is happy with it - fine, but it's not free speech at that point.

Rights are both limited and granted in this world only by governments. A government can grant whatever level of speech it sees fit, as long as it continues to have power. If it limits speech, speech is not free no matter how much leeway is given, and whether that particular limitation is perceived as right or wrong.

Someone who is a racist should be allowed to speak his or her mind - the people that don't want to listen to it don't have to. The people that perform violence as a result of what someone says should be held accountable for their actions, and if appropriate, the original speaker to whatever extent is reasonable.

I'm not saying there may not be a perceived reason to limit certain speech, but therein lies the devil when the body politic starts deciding where the line to free speech begins - and ends.
 
The limit of freedom of speach is the prohibition of incitement to racial hatred (Ariel81).

Why should he not be allowed to express his point of view? It is his right to dislike the neighboring countries, look down on them and express his dislike/disdain.
I never saw him go around encouraging people to beat up Bolivians and Paraguayans. I never saw him incite violence.
The fact that I strongly disagree with his point of views and often even ridicule it, does change the fact that I feel very strongly that it should be his right to express those points of views, no matter how much I might detest it. Freedom of speech exist exactly to protect the exp<b></b>ression of unpopular, controversial and disliked points of view.
I find Ariel and what he writes, no matter how racist, harmless compared to those who want to suppress free speech.
 
Nope not confused. I'm well aware that law can be used to censor. That's what I'm talking about. You're confused about the meaning of "free speech." Deciding that "racissm" is illegal is no different than deciding that blasphemy is illegal or questioning the govt. is illegal. You're probably "confused" and think you can arbitrarily decide what is the "limit" of free speech based on content because you never read any of the original arguments for free speech in people like Mill.

Good job aping the speaking patterns of USA journalists though, "you're confused," etc. ...what a pompous donkey.

Is this hate speech too? It sounds quiet different from when Ariel does it. It's pretty obvious (is it?) for the general population which is incitement to "violence" (hatred is not an act) and which is (perhaps) misled curiosity; but who should legally decide?
The Uruguayan government recently banned certain costumes from their "World Longest Carnival". If I were to describe which were the costumes the security people of Uruguay were actually worried about and the ones they threw in as fillers to appear less honest, I think that would be some sort of hate speech too.
 
I don't do freedom of speach cases.

If Clarin can openly lie (sometimes) and attack the goverment they way they do, it is obvious that there is freedom of speach.

If all the people who post calling kretina to the President can do it, this is another example.


Very true my man... for that very reason Fatima Florez pulled her act imitating CFK in Mardel Theater. :wub:

Ambito and Buenos Aires Herald are Pro-K under their new owner...! :rolleyes:
 
When I was a kid, I was told

"Shhhh....even wall have ears. Look, think, analyze before you speak. And as far as possible never discuss politics and religion with anyone other than immediate family members. It can create unwanted turmoil in your life"

So I abide by it.

The more I notice that feeling that I am nervous or uncomfortable stating my views, the more I see that feeling as symptomatic that I do not live in the free society that I had imagined or been sold by indoctrination. This realization actually increases my sense of personal responsibility to express and act on my views. The more we submit to cowardice, the less free the society will become until the consequences are so ugly I would not wish them on future generations.
 
Nope not confused. I'm well aware that law can be used to censor. That's what I'm talking about. You're confused about the meaning of "free speech." Deciding that "racissm" is illegal is no different than deciding that blasphemy is illegal or questioning the govt. is illegal. You're probably "confused" and think you can arbitrarily decide what is the "limit" of free speech based on content because you never read any of the original arguments for free speech in people like Mill.

Good job aping the speaking patterns of USA journalists though, "you're confused," etc. ...what a pompous donkey.

In the common law societies there were some institutions that were very advanced some hundred years ago like the habeas corpus, the carta magna and freedom of speach.

The WWII ans its 50 million people dead created the consensus that there are basic rights that should be respected to every human being: human rights. The reason the States recognized these rights to its subjects is to avoid another world war and genocidals.

In the last 70 years the human right international law, soft law and Courts had had an fast development.

In this context is clear that there doesn't exist a right to express your hate about somebody else race, nationality or religion. This is not included in the right of freedom of speach.

Here you have something written about common law:
https://books.google.com.ar/books?id=4Ldb0cIbS7kC&pg=PA179&lpg=PA179&dq=freedom+of+speech+race+hate&source=bl&ots=vgTJOqElVf&sig=7DK63skAZ5recxSs1FQNhQkiXpY&hl=es&sa=X&ei=Q6TGVN7XEOaIsQSgqoLIAQ&ved=0CCkQ6AEwBA


 
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