RodalfoWalsh
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Ries are you really a blacksmith? Do you have an online portfolio?
The Argentine Time Tunnel.
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Gringoboy
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With a statement like that you owe us an explanation then.
Most of us have our own views on La Campora but it would be an eye opener to hear it from the horse's mouth.
Rich One
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Easy !!! Campora Hector was a heavy set dentist from Mercedes?? Became President in 1973 in lieu of Peron who was banned from Politics. Campora al Gobierno Peron al Poder...!!
Ries
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yes, I am really a blacksmith. But I dont shoe horses, or make knives. I have been making furniture, fences, railings, stairs, balconies, signs, lighting, seating, and artwork for over 30 years- in the USA, not in CABA. In CABA, I only have a departmento. No room for martillo pillon, or other gigantic machines that weigh thousands of kilos and require lots of power, and make lots of noise.
There will be an interesting gathering of blacksmiths in Parque Rivadavia, in the beginning of March next year, with public demonstrations and construction of an artwork. It is a joint venture by US and Argentine blacksmiths, the first of its kind.
My website is www.riesniemi.com
Noesdeayer
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Ries First of all,a big Hola to Haedo! I visited friends there all thru the 70s before moving to B.A. in '79.So you meant that Argentina was really isolated before the internet.Very true.Although I believe that was the same situation worldwide.It was even more isolated in the 70s and 80s.I remember getting an international phone call at a home in Haedo in the mid 70s using oceanic cables when it was almost impossiuble to understand the voices.Thanks for the welcome clarification.I agree with your point of view now.
Rich One Hector Campora was president for 49 horrendous days from May 25 until July 13,1973 ended by the Ezeiza Massacre the day Peron returned with 13 dead and 365 wounded due to a gunfight between rightist and leftist factions in the Peronist Party itself.The designation of Lopez Rega, *El Mago.The Wizzard" a Rasputin like character who heavily influenced Isabelita after Peron died shortly after becoming president himself.was one one the most bizzare and lamentable episodes in Argentina's history.And Maximao names a youth group after him.Doesn't that tell us something?
Rich One Hector Campora was president for 49 horrendous days from May 25 until July 13,1973 ended by the Ezeiza Massacre the day Peron returned with 13 dead and 365 wounded due to a gunfight between rightist and leftist factions in the Peronist Party itself.The designation of Lopez Rega, *El Mago.The Wizzard" a Rasputin like character who heavily influenced Isabelita after Peron died shortly after becoming president himself.was one one the most bizzare and lamentable episodes in Argentina's history.And Maximao names a youth group after him.Doesn't that tell us something?
World as a whole became global village and though Argentina resists as much as it can, it couldn't escape few benefits.
I was not here in 90',but according to many Argentines, country is in steady decline on most of the levels. Few enlightened souls don't change general picture.
I was not here in 90',but according to many Argentines, country is in steady decline on most of the levels. Few enlightened souls don't change general picture.
Ries
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I have been a part time resident since 2007.
I see far more wealth, more new cars, more TVs and fancy phones, more people drinking expensive starbucks coffee.
I also see people able to make money in ways that didnt exist in the 90s.
I know various working class people- (even though NOBODY in Argentina considers themselves working class- EVERYBODY is middle class, according to them- http://www.bubblear....lly-convenient/)
who are able to make a living doing stuff that was frankly impossible 25 years ago.
Fer instance, I know a poor, single mother, who worked her way thru a degree in Idumentaria at UBA, over about 5 or 6 years, taking the bus in from suburbs about 2 hours out.
She now designs and makes shoes and leather goods, herself, at home, and sells em on facebook, and makes a living at it.
Now, granted, she is smart, and motivated. But she is not rich, has no backing- I have been with her to the leather and shoe supply stores in Boedo, where she buys 500 pesos of materials, makes them into 3000 pesos worth of shoes, and sells them.
In the 90s, she would have been a shopgirl, or working in a sewing factory.
Ever seen the movie Pizza, birra, faso?
In the 90s, this girl might have been the girl in the movie- at the mercy of idiotic "men".
Women like this today have many more options.
I know other argentines like this too- part of the reason is due to knowing more about the world, due to the internet.
Part is because of the ease social networking allows you in selling things- I know several people who make their livings from Mercado Libre.
Part of it is less strict religious, government, and class rules in everyday life.
Part of it is better transportation, better communication, and better education- all of which have improved noticeably since the 90s.
I know another woman from Remedios de Escalada, which is pretty much the poor exurbs personified.
In the 90s, she would have been pregnant and married at 18.
She is still lower middle class, today, but her music, and the new ways of distributing it, means she can play at concerts around Argentina, and in other South American countries. She can put out CDs, play at the CCK, and have a career.
She probably would make more as bureaucrat with the post office, but the freedom and possibilities in Argentina today are much more- for anyone, regardless of class or income, who chooses to take advantage.
of course, if you just sit at home and smoke paco, things are no better.
I see far more wealth, more new cars, more TVs and fancy phones, more people drinking expensive starbucks coffee.
I also see people able to make money in ways that didnt exist in the 90s.
I know various working class people- (even though NOBODY in Argentina considers themselves working class- EVERYBODY is middle class, according to them- http://www.bubblear....lly-convenient/)
who are able to make a living doing stuff that was frankly impossible 25 years ago.
Fer instance, I know a poor, single mother, who worked her way thru a degree in Idumentaria at UBA, over about 5 or 6 years, taking the bus in from suburbs about 2 hours out.
She now designs and makes shoes and leather goods, herself, at home, and sells em on facebook, and makes a living at it.
Now, granted, she is smart, and motivated. But she is not rich, has no backing- I have been with her to the leather and shoe supply stores in Boedo, where she buys 500 pesos of materials, makes them into 3000 pesos worth of shoes, and sells them.
In the 90s, she would have been a shopgirl, or working in a sewing factory.
Ever seen the movie Pizza, birra, faso?
In the 90s, this girl might have been the girl in the movie- at the mercy of idiotic "men".
Women like this today have many more options.
I know other argentines like this too- part of the reason is due to knowing more about the world, due to the internet.
Part is because of the ease social networking allows you in selling things- I know several people who make their livings from Mercado Libre.
Part of it is less strict religious, government, and class rules in everyday life.
Part of it is better transportation, better communication, and better education- all of which have improved noticeably since the 90s.
I know another woman from Remedios de Escalada, which is pretty much the poor exurbs personified.
In the 90s, she would have been pregnant and married at 18.
She is still lower middle class, today, but her music, and the new ways of distributing it, means she can play at concerts around Argentina, and in other South American countries. She can put out CDs, play at the CCK, and have a career.
She probably would make more as bureaucrat with the post office, but the freedom and possibilities in Argentina today are much more- for anyone, regardless of class or income, who chooses to take advantage.
of course, if you just sit at home and smoke paco, things are no better.
Matiasba
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You guys have to understand. This country up to the seventies was all middle class. A very wide, mobile middle class. The tip of the rhombus, a 3% of upper class, and the same number to the bottom.
Im living in Mexico, and I still can not understand how marked and notorious are the differences between classes here. A very classist society, with a lot of poverty. Not a rhombus, but a triangle, with very marked strata.
Mobility was a distinct feature of Argentine society. Up to 1976 we have the same gini index than Canada, and no more than 6% of poverty. We were much more developed than Spain, to name a country with similar characteristics than ours.
This picture started to change in the 70s with neoliberalismo imposed by force (dictatorship) and other time by force (hyperinflation created by creditors of the debt of dictatorship) in 1990.
Then, in the 90s, the upper classes tried a closure, by consolidating them and sending more than 40% to the poverty, we started to see changes, such as cartoneros in the streets, informal job, sellers everywhere, poverty, insecurity, all those things didnt exist in Argentina till the 90s. And it wasnt just the 2001 crisis, it was 10 years of + 25% unemployment, of closing companies, national companies, PYMES, the industria nacional conmpanies. A real poverty factory. Menem changed the social map of this country, and even the Ks with huge social planning could not change this back.
So the country I talk is long gone.
But the gini index got better, and the redistribution of wealth really and trully improved dduring the K years. Industry grew as never before since Perons last government.
Im living in Mexico, and I still can not understand how marked and notorious are the differences between classes here. A very classist society, with a lot of poverty. Not a rhombus, but a triangle, with very marked strata.
Mobility was a distinct feature of Argentine society. Up to 1976 we have the same gini index than Canada, and no more than 6% of poverty. We were much more developed than Spain, to name a country with similar characteristics than ours.
This picture started to change in the 70s with neoliberalismo imposed by force (dictatorship) and other time by force (hyperinflation created by creditors of the debt of dictatorship) in 1990.
Then, in the 90s, the upper classes tried a closure, by consolidating them and sending more than 40% to the poverty, we started to see changes, such as cartoneros in the streets, informal job, sellers everywhere, poverty, insecurity, all those things didnt exist in Argentina till the 90s. And it wasnt just the 2001 crisis, it was 10 years of + 25% unemployment, of closing companies, national companies, PYMES, the industria nacional conmpanies. A real poverty factory. Menem changed the social map of this country, and even the Ks with huge social planning could not change this back.
So the country I talk is long gone.
But the gini index got better, and the redistribution of wealth really and trully improved dduring the K years. Industry grew as never before since Perons last government.
camberiu
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Yes, that must be why the Marxist movement here in Argentina was so big back in the 1970s. Because that is what middle classes with high mobility index do, they take up arms and start terrorist activities to overthrow the bourgeoisie. Hey, they are doing that in Canada right now. They have a revolutionary leader over there in Montreal called Ernest Guedikian. Yeah, Marxist guerrilas are super normal and a common sight, specially in countries that have Canadian levels of GINI indexes and 6% poverty.
And yet somehow Mexico has a better life expectancy than that of Argentina (Death by crimes included).
http://goo.gl/T9HVhZ
At least Matias is finally admitting he's an avid admirer of the Ks, no matter how wrong-headed 
And I keep wondering why he's in Mexico if even now Argentina is better than it was for the Ks policies (after they have "lifted" the country up after decades of "capitalistic" mismanagement, of course), he living in a place where there's so much poverty and class distinction. And yeah, of course, there's none here at all. I notice, for example, that everyone here invites the local knife sharpener to dinner on a regular basis...not.
Ah for a little bit of critical thinking outside of propaganda...instead blame the past on everyone that was in power to try to make the current lies fit the mold that things are actually better so the current crooks can remain in power.
But as "everyone knows" government is the only solution for Argentina's problems, to force everyone into the same marching step, to force everything to be "equal". That's why a company in 1999 was able to recover itself by force of workers actually uniting under their own volition (re Scioli's thesis at UADE - which of course Scioli had nothing to do with beyond writing about, not that I'm tooting Scioli's horn at all) and Cristina cries "traitor" when another company tries to declare bankruptcy more recently.
One tends to cause relative harmony and a good feeling of accomplishment (along with the reality of accomplishment), the other tends to cause class warfare, hate and strife while making the government look good to ignorant people filled with such propaganda..
Seems as though people like Matias prefer the class warfare approach, which has demonstrated time and again its utter ineffectiveness.
And I keep wondering why he's in Mexico if even now Argentina is better than it was for the Ks policies (after they have "lifted" the country up after decades of "capitalistic" mismanagement, of course), he living in a place where there's so much poverty and class distinction. And yeah, of course, there's none here at all. I notice, for example, that everyone here invites the local knife sharpener to dinner on a regular basis...not.Ah for a little bit of critical thinking outside of propaganda...instead blame the past on everyone that was in power to try to make the current lies fit the mold that things are actually better so the current crooks can remain in power.
But as "everyone knows" government is the only solution for Argentina's problems, to force everyone into the same marching step, to force everything to be "equal". That's why a company in 1999 was able to recover itself by force of workers actually uniting under their own volition (re Scioli's thesis at UADE - which of course Scioli had nothing to do with beyond writing about, not that I'm tooting Scioli's horn at all) and Cristina cries "traitor" when another company tries to declare bankruptcy more recently.
One tends to cause relative harmony and a good feeling of accomplishment (along with the reality of accomplishment), the other tends to cause class warfare, hate and strife while making the government look good to ignorant people filled with such propaganda..
Seems as though people like Matias prefer the class warfare approach, which has demonstrated time and again its utter ineffectiveness.
