What crimes have you been a victim of in BA?

[lamarque]

You should post the rules as in the first pool realized long time ago, so the information is more accurate:
Given the number of members it is possible to get a realistic statistics of the subsection of society, which frequent baExpats.

Please respond from your own personal experience and not governed by your knowledge of others having been the victims of crime in BsAs.

Why? If seven other persons were present when your pocket was picked, we run the risk of counting eight instead of one; if your coat was stolen at an expat dinner, then perhaps 32 for 1.

Before you answer, please read all the definitions carefully. You may find some crimes missing, if so please indicate this in a post, but be aware that the number of options in a poll is limited to 10.

Definitions:

Personally: You. Does not include your spouse, girl-/boy-friend, children, parents, etc.

Pickpocketing: to steal valuables from a person without their noticing the theft at the time.

Burglary: entry into a building for the purposes of committing the crime of theft.

Theft: the illegal taking of another person's property, i.e. without that person's freely-given consent.

Armed robbery: seizing property through violence or demonstrated threat of violence by showing a weapon.

Robbery: seizing property through intimidation and/or threat, no arms visible.

Stabbing: the penetration of any body part using a sharp or pointed object at close range.

Shooting: the penetration of any body part by a projectile from a firearm.

Well definitions are not updated but you get what was my point lol

 

[lamarque]

I selected I have had my personal things stolen although it wasn't a successful attempt as despite grabbing my bag and phone, I managed to hold on to them. I didn't select (but think I could have) I have been robbed since both my best friend and my boyfriend had their trucks stolen from the street (Libertador) in front of my apartment while visiting me.

That is the thing in order to put accurate result the crime has to be again your person not friends that were with you or any other figure like that, imagine a meeting of 30 expats that one get stolen in the way to the meeting if everybody use the same criteria as you it would count as 30 person has been stolen when in reality one of them has been stolen only, the think is that in order to compare with the previous post the admin should put the same rules and the same 10 fields that the original Poll had. That way would be a really useful information and easy to compare with the polls of other years, the other thing is that now a day there are expats that has been here for a longer time than back in the 2006 so the chance of getting robbed are bigger that why the poll should be done within a period of time but as the original was without time lapse then is still difficult to compare anyway, sorry if I’m to annoying about accuracy is just that I would find the data collected very useful for a work I’m in progress and I think people will find a better answer to the difficult question of crime if we do a real statistic with all the rules explained, same 10 fields as the original and comparable with the previous poll.

 

[nicoenarg]

That is the thing in order to put accurate result the crime has to be again your person not friends that were with you or any other figure like that, imagine a meeting of 30 expats that one get stolen in the way to the meeting if everybody use the same criteria as you it would count as 30 person has been stolen when in reality one of them has been stolen only, the think is that in order to compare with the previous post the admin should put the same rules and the same 10 fields that the original Poll had. That way would be a really useful information and easy to compare with the polls of other years, the other thing is that now a day there are expats that has been here for a longer time than back in the 2006 so the chance of getting robbed are bigger that why the poll should be done within a period of time but as the original was without time lapse then is still difficult to compare anyway, sorry if I’m to annoying about accuracy is just that I would find the data collected very useful for a work I’m in progress and I think people will find a better answer to the difficult question of crime if we do a real statistic with all the rules explained, same 10 fields as the original and comparable with the previous poll.

Uh I know there are some expats on this forum but reality is that not every single expat within Buenos Aires is registered on here.

I know the admin was looking for people to say if they personally have been victims of a crime in Buenos Aires but does that actually paint an accurate picture either way?

In the case of citygirl whose boyfriend and her best friend have both had their trucks stolen. Now I am assuming those two are not registered on this forum and the only "spokesperson" on this forum for those two is citygirl.

Lamarque, the criteria you have pasted in the post above, I think it was from the previous poll that allcraz mentioned, falsely assumes that every resident, or at least every expat of Buenos Aires is registered on this forum, which obviously is not true.

To me giving grand examples of how it could multiply one act of robbery against one person into 32 is a depserate attempt to give a controlled picture of how many people have been robbed.

I haven't taken part in this poll because I have personally not been robbed, but that does not mean that all the others that I know for a fact have been robbed and are not on this forum are either insignificant or straight out lying.

The reason people, or at least the reason I write things on this forum related to Buenos Aires is that this forum is the only comprehensive source of information in English regarding Buenos Aires and Argentina. This poll is going to be, sadly, misleading because to begin with we have decided to shut up stories that are not personal even if they happened right in front of our eyes, to our loved ones.

At the end of the day, its the admin's poll and they can decide what they want with it but lamarque let them handle it and try not to create your own rules about it.

You started a thread and contrary to my beliefs, it turned out to be a decent one afterall. I said it there and I will say it again, you will try to look at any story on crime or any poll taken with your perspective and will always try to play down the seriousness of crime because you personally seem to believe that its all bloated out of proportion and that Buenos Aires is not dangerous and the crime situation is not getting worse.

That's your perspective. I am not one of those people who think "you can have your own version of reality and truth" and so I disagree with your perspective but then again, you are entitled to your opinions and I am to mine.

 

[scottlyon]

I get what you are saying lamarque and appreciate it in a quality control manner but 'expats' does not a consistent community make.

For example:

Robbery: seizing property through intimidation and/or threat, no arms visible.

This could easily be perceived as a good salesperson procuring cash through legitimate means as well as a couple of thugs threatening someone in a toilet depending upon the 'victim.

One more:

Pickpocketing: to steal valuables from a person without their noticing the theft at the time.

Someone genuinely loses their keys/phone/wallet as can happen. Do they get to vote that they were pickpocketed because it makes them feel less ditsy?

I think the best we can hope for is a rough snapshot of various people's perceptions upon crime in Buenos Aires from varying personal and cultural angles and agendas.

I know it's semantics, but that's the backbone of clear communication.

 

[LostinBA]

1. Assaulted - watch robbery

2. Lots countless pieces of clothing (brand names jackets, sweaters, umbrellas, hats) at BsAs bars, restaurants, and even in the Wash DC airport where an otherwise upper middle class 'looking' Argentine woman stole my airplane boarding pass and expensive wool sweater while waiting for a flight to EZE in 2001.

3. Lost expensive sunglasses, electronics, etc in my apartment stolen by Argentine visitors (friends of friends) during parties.

4. Apartment owners attempting to steal my deposit. One I had to finally threaten physically. Totally alien to do that but it was finally the only way to get the money back. The other took a deposit, changed her mind about renting to a foreigner and then thought she could keep the deposit.

5. Stopped someone from stealing my MacBook pro in 2006. (in Las Canitas)

6. Stopped an otherwise normal looking 30ish man from stealing my Golden Retriever when she was a 6 month old puppy (in Las Canitas)

7. Cleaning lady stole 2000 pesos from my apartment.

8. The ever-irritating but infrequent cases of taxi drivers swapping good bill for counterfeit ones. Doesn't really work anymore...

9. Ex building porter who stole 8 bottles of wine from a party and who twice tried unsuccessfully to steal money in safe by attempting to break it.

The funniest was when someone stole 5 sets of BOSE noise reduction headsets (400 USD/each) from first class on a flight from the USA to BsAs. When the announcement came on asking for their return, I just sat back and laughed.

There definitely seems to be a different concept of what constitutes theft here...I guess when you are raised in a country where all of the politicians, most business people, bankers, etc are outright thieves, it skews your idea of right and wrong.

 

[Aleina Dee]

None.
As far as the "I know someone who has been ... "in my opinion is not admissible. What if I know 10 people who would report no incidents ?
I think it must be reduced to personal experience only. This not an accurate survey of the crime rate, but a reality versus forum mood/forum opinion bias poll.
Reader,even if you do not write normally vote here.

 

[lamarque]

Uh I know there are some expats on this forum but reality is that not every single expat within Buenos Aires is registered on here.

I know the admin was looking for people to say if they personally have been victims of a crime in Buenos Aires but does that actually paint an accurate picture either way?

In the case of citygirl whose boyfriend and her best friend have both had their trucks stolen. Now I am assuming those two are not registered on this forum and the only "spokesperson" on this forum for those two is citygirl.

Lamarque, the criteria you have pasted in the post above, I think it was from the previous poll that allcraz mentioned, falsely assumes that every resident, or at least every expat of Buenos Aires is registered on this forum, which obviously is not true.

To me giving grand examples of how it could multiply one act of robbery against one person into 32 is a depserate attempt to give a controlled picture of how many people have been robbed.

I haven't taken part in this poll because I have personally not been robbed, but that does not mean that all the others that I know for a fact have been robbed and are not on this forum are either insignificant or straight out lying.

The reason people, or at least the reason I write things on this forum related to Buenos Aires is that this forum is the only comprehensive source of information in English regarding Buenos Aires and Argentina. This poll is going to be, sadly, misleading because to begin with we have decided to shut up stories that are not personal even if they happened right in front of our eyes, to our loved ones.

At the end of the day, its the admin's poll and they can decide what they want with it but lamarque let them handle it and try not to create your own rules about it.

You started a thread and contrary to my beliefs, it turned out to be a decent one afterall. I said it there and I will say it again, you will try to look at any story on crime or any poll taken with your perspective and will always try to play down the seriousness of crime because you personally seem to believe that its all bloated out of proportion and that Buenos Aires is not dangerous and the crime situation is not getting worse.

That's your perspective. I am not one of those people who think "you can have your own version of reality and truth" and so I disagree with your perspective but then again, you are entitled to your opinions and I am to mine.

Nico this is about statistic, what you say here don't make any sense, you don't need everyone in the forum to vote in order to get accurate results, have you ever study statistic? you know how statistical measures work? if people will report because someone that he know has suffer and incident then you will have a really inaccurate number, because let suppose that every person in this forum know at least 30 persons so the change that this person or anyone this person knows have suffer an incident is 30 times bigger, you cannot make an statistic like that is just nonsense, the other problem is that if you want to put every person you know that has suffer an incident the you should put every person you know that doesn't and we all know that the first one remembered is the persons that has suffer something so then the statistic will again suffer a big distortion. If you haven't suffer any incident just put that as if you are not putting that you just cause an distortion in the statistic try to collaborate and then you can complain as much as you want.
You should trust that between all the people in the forum it will arrive to a aceptable sample of what is the incident rate between the people in this forum, off course a real statistic have to be done with a lapse of time to see what are the odds in the lapse of 1 year, and have to be comparable but maybe for that the rules should be improved, as other people say is just to have an idea I would like some quality controls but that is another thing.
You never take all the population in an area to do a statistic; you take only a representative sample.

Now that i have try to explain statistic as is something i really like and i had study in my degree, i pass to clarify you thing you have write:
''In the case of citygirl whose boyfriend and her best friend have both had their trucks stolen. Now I am assuming those two are not registered on this forum and the only "spokesperson" on this forum for those two is citygirl.''
That is the problem if she add other people that has suffer incident been around her then she have to add people that has not suffer any incident in her presence and that only mess things up.
''You started a thread and contrary to my beliefs, it turned out to be a decent one after all.''
thank for your trust lol
''I said it there and I will say it again, you will try to look at any story on crime or any poll taken with your perspective and will always try to play down the seriousness of crime because you personally seem to believe that its all bloated out of proportion and that Buenos Aires is not dangerous and the crime situation is not getting worse.''
You are confuse here, i didn't say Buenos Aires is not dangerous, i say is relatively not dangerous ''relative to others citys around the world of it size'' there is a big difference between not been dangerous and relatively not been dangerous, the other thing is that i say in my believe Buenos Aires is getting worse, but as i say in the other topic that why i opened i want to know how much is true and how much is perception, but please read again the other topic and you will see that at least 5 times i put that in my personal believe i think Buenos Aires is getting unsafe, if you don't find it i can copy paste all the places were i told that if you really want that, is not cool that people say things one never have told.

 

[LostinBA]

Nico this is about statistic, what you say here don't make any sense, you don't need everyone in the forum to vote in order to get accurate results, have you ever study statistic? you know how statistical measures work? if people will report because someone that he know has suffer and incident then you will have a really inaccurate number, because let suppose that every person in this forum know at least 30 persons so the change that this person or anyone this person knows have suffer an incident is 30 times bigger, you cannot make an statistic like that is just nonsense, the other problem is that if you want to put every person you know that has suffer an incident the you should put every person you know that doesn't and we all know that the first one remembered is the persons that has suffer something so then the statistic will again suffer a big distortion. If you haven't suffer any incident just put that as if you are not putting that you just cause an distortion in the statistic try to collaborate and then you can complain as much as you want.
You should trust that between all the people in the forum it will arrive to a aceptable sample of what is the incident rate between the people in this forum, off course a real statistic have to be done with a lapse of time to see what are the odds in the lapse of 1 year, and have to be comparable but maybe for that the rules should be improved, as other people say is just to have an idea I would like some quality controls but that is another thing.
You never take all the population in an area to do a statistic; you take only a representative sample.

Please use more '.s'

 

[nicoenarg]

Nico this is about statistic, what you say here don't make any sense, you don't need everyone in the forum to vote in order to get accurate results, have you ever study statistic? you know how statistical measures work? if people will report because someone that he know has suffer and incident then you will have a really inaccurate number, because let suppose that every person in this forum know at least 30 persons so the change that this person or anyone this person knows have suffer an incident is 30 times bigger, you cannot make an statistic like that is just nonsense, the other problem is that if you want to put every person you know that has suffer an incident the you should put every person you know that doesn't and we all know that the first one remembered is the persons that has suffer something so then the statistic will again suffer a big distortion. If you haven't suffer any incident just put that as if you are not putting that you just cause an distortion in the statistic try to collaborate and then you can complain as much as you want.
You should trust that between all the people in the forum it will arrive to a aceptable sample of what is the incident rate between the people in this forum, off course a real statistic have to be done with a lapse of time to see what are the odds in the lapse of 1 year, and have to be comparable but maybe for that the rules should be improved, as other people say is just to have an idea I would like some quality controls but that is another thing.
You never take all the population in an area to do a statistic; you take only a representative sample.

Lamarque,

In your bid to try to teach me what Statistics is, I think you might have misread my post. Anyway.

Yes I have studied Statistics, have you? Any statistical study is done with predefined criteria. And I was actually going against your predefined criteria which, to be honest, is as ridiculous as what you seem to be writing in the post above.

Let me say it again in as plain English as I possibly can. Not every expat in Buenos Aires is a part of this forum. I didn't say everyone on this forum had to vote for this to be accurate. All I said was, keeping the case of citygirl in mind, that there are a lot of expats that are not registered on this forum. Keeping the fact in mind that this forum is one of the best sources of information in English on Buenos Aires and Argentina, when you try to discount the robberies that citygirl's boyfriend and her best friend experienced, then you're trying to discount actual events that happened. Seeing that those two are not on this forum and also seeing that you told their "spokesperson" to basically shut up, you have already skewed the data in your favor.

Now, 1 turns into 30 or 32. Yeah sure, sounds pretty awful doesn't it? But your assumption, which I find pretty darn ignorant, is that every expat on this forum is, in one way or another, connected to every other expat. That our individual experiences are connected to every other expat and that they affect every other expat. How did you come to the conclusion that just because citygirl's friends had the experience means that every other expat on this forum knows about that and will vote on it accordingly?

Lamarque, once again, I'm sorry but your argument is fallacious. And the fallacy lies in exactly this: We are not a tightly knit community of expats who are all connected to each other as though in a circle. A lot of us are here with our Argentine significant others and are connected to Argentina through their families.

So let's dispense with the BS that you just tried to pull in giving me a class. Like I said before, at the end of the day this poll was started by the admin, so let's let them handle it. Don't try to be a referee where you weren't appointed as one. We all have our opinions, let's not try to skew things started by others in our favor.

 

[lamarque]

None.
As far as the "I know someone who has been ... "in my opinion is not admissible. What if I know 10 people who would report no incidents ?
I think it must be reduced to personal experience only. This not an accurate survey of the crime rate, but a reality versus forum mood/forum opinion bias poll.
Reader,even if you do not write normally vote here.

To bad that this hasn't been clarify at the beginning lol now there is space for people to vote with diferent opinion about what to consider a crime, as put that you suffer a crime because you know someone that has suffer one, very improbable that someone will actually read all this clarifications .