What the hell is a "North American"?

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oh, Porteños feel the same way. ¨Dont talk to the help.¨ They are astounded when I tell them about lawyer friends of mine working at Morton´s Steakhouse in Chicago making $120k in tips waiting tables.
 
YanquiGallego said:
oh, Porteños feel the same way. ¨Dont talk to the help.¨ They are astounded when I tell them about lawyer friends of mine working at Morton´s Steakhouse in Chicago making $120k in tips waiting tables.

Really? I didn't know that. Judging by the constitution of this country, I thought people would have a different mindset.
 
YanquiGallego said:
oh, Porteños feel the same way. ¨Dont talk to the help.¨ They are astounded when I tell them about lawyer friends of mine working at Morton´s Steakhouse in Chicago making $120k in tips waiting tables.


It's one of the first real cultural shocks I encountered in Bsas. Even in Ireland or US I would have asked my cleaner to have a cup of tea with me, even lunch and gossip ...to find that in Bsas educated people called their maids La peruana or housed mothers away from their kids in a poky room with a tv for 6 out of 7 days, even my cleaner was made to absail down her former employer's house to clean the gutters (she was 50 something at the time, I kid you not!) and considered that good treatment made me so mad...but then I realised it's a cultural thing. They're paid help and thank goodness it isn't as per the caste system where theyre considered untouchables. And we as expats can show them a new way to live treating our cleaners or househelp as equals without whom we couldnt work etc...
 
Delfina said:
The worst nickname I know belongs to a friend of a friend: Cancer! He's tall and thin, he's been called like that since he was 12, and doesn't seem to mind.

And back to the topic, it's funny how this debate made me think how I refer to people.. I never say "Americano", it just doesn't come out like that for me, but I really don't mind how they call themselves.

I just say cariñosamente "yanqui" o "de estados unidos". "Estadounidense" is too long and very complicated to pronounce, and "Norteamericano" is a bit grasa, sory gordos.


That's gordito, por favor. It sounds better somehow than gordo.
 
lovinit said:
What's the deal? This is the deal. It's just more arrogant, self-absorbed, delusional Argentine BS. We Americans ourselves and everybody else in the world calls us Americans. But not Argentines. They know better. What a surprise.

And if you weren't aware, that's not their only arrogant reality disconnect. How about official inflation rates ridiculed by everyone in and out of Argentina except its own govt. Or how about 180 years of obsessing and ignoring the fact of British occupation, control, culture, citizenship and naming of the Falkland Islands as recognized by the entire world? Or the notion of the right to force it all to change by arms when repeated agressive assertions doesn't work? The most recent version is more international whining and arm-twisting. Wake up Argentina! Nobody gives a shit.

I'm gettin' warmed up now. How about acting as though they are the only drivers on the road or pedestrians on the sidewalk and being willing to put others in real danger? Or how they act as if they're doing you a favor to serve you in a commercial or bureaucratic context?

What about letting a few disgruntled protesters cut the freeway to the country's international airport for hours without government intervention inconveniencing thousands and costing time and money and missed flights? Or for that matter cutting any major thoroughfare in the Cap. Fed. without consequences?

Or how about protectionist trade policies in favor of Industria Argentina (it's charitable even to call it that) so Argentines have few retail choices except shoddy Argentine goods or overpriced import-taxed goods from the real commercial world that only the polo-players can afford?

And do you imagine Argentines understand that they themselves are the source of their problems? No, never. It's always somebody else. Anybody else. And if it isn't the chankees and the CIA it must be the fault of those puto hard-working, competent, and well-organized capitalist tools in Chile, Brazil and Uruguay.

Or what about how they don't show up for appointments or keep commitments, or lie about why not or that they think an intimate relationship a game to be played? What about yelling all the time, in a grating tone that can damage hearing?

Or how about etc. etc. etc. ad nauseam. No problem. Don't confuse me with the facts....already made up my mind. Soy Argentino.

My conclusion is that the operative cultural imperative here is "yo". Yo, yo, yo, yo. No vos. Yo soy mas importante que vos. In every example cited this is at the core. A shameless assertion of self-importance permeates the culture from inter-personal to inter-national.

I think it must begin with child-rearing practices...don't know how else people could get these ideas. When I asked an Argentine child psychiatrist what was up with all the selfish behavior in this culture she referred me to a book by an Israeli psychologist entitled "Su Majestad el Bebe" exploring the consequences of no limits parenting. http://www.lanacion.com.ar/1411069-su-majestad-el-bebe-un-modelo-de-crianza-a-desterrar

Uh oh. Last but not least I forgot the crime. You know, the not-especially-serious problem that damn near everyone you know has been a multiple victim of and that's responsible for that happy smile you see everyday on the face of the average porteño. And my God, what about the video horror show of the Frenchman gutted for his camera dying on the sidewalk in front of the monument to Argentine hubris at the hands of a local lowlife. That was the last friggin straw for me.

And please don't react to this post by telling me about American or any others' delusions, neuroses or bad habits or similar conditions. Of course we have them. Lots. Everybody does. But denial and blame (Argentine specialties) don't alter an iota of the truth about any of it, personal or national, and are in fact the most effective strategies for continuing to labor under our illusions and suffering the painful consequences.

And please don't ask me why I'm still here either. I'm going...if you couldn't tell...I've had it. Give me the happy Brazilians, the organized Chilenos or the quiet, polite and friendly Ecuadorians any day. Y Chau.

Four very polite Ecuadorian teens stuck a knife in my ribs and stole my money, watch and keys in broad daylight in an otherwise respectable part of Quito. They did say, por favor, though. As in, "Plata! Plata! Plata! Por Favor!"
Buen viaje.
 
YanquiGallego said:
oh, Porteños feel the same way. ¨Dont talk to the help.¨ They are astounded when I tell them about lawyer friends of mine working at Morton´s Steakhouse in Chicago making $120k in tips waiting tables.

what porteños are you hanging out with? My friends ALL are super kind and friendly with their maids, have lunch with them, know their kids, go to their birthdays, bring presents from trips and consider them part of the family.

not to say that everyone's nice, but I wouldn't be friends with someone that thinks they can't talk to the help. not everyone's like that.
 
dr__dawggy said:
Four very polite Ecuadorian teens stuck a knife in my ribs and stole my money, watch and keys in broad daylight in an otherwise respectable part of Quito. They did say, por favor, though. As in, "Plata! Plata! Plata! Por Favor!"
Buen viaje.

I was going to say... I couldn't even walk around my neighborhood in Quito after dark. We lived in a gated apartment complex (alongside one of Quito's gated housing communities where all of the diplomats lived) in a neighborhood "lleno de pelucones" (their words, not mine).

There they have TV programs dedicated to people calling in to report crimes because people are too scared to call the police. I believe the program was called something like, "Denúncialo."

In Guayaquil, express kidnappings in taxis were a weekly occurrence, sometimes happening 3-5 times a week.

Going out in Quito at night? The nightlife area is patrolled by the military, it seems. I was told that it couldn't even compare to Central America, but still, to see police/military guys walking around with enormous rifles/machine guns? It wasn't very reassuring.

La inseguridad in Argentina is a problem, but I'm afraid that it doesn't hold a candle to many other places around the world.
 
Wow if that bugs you, just wait to you bring up the Falklands. Lol have you seen a world map yet? Welcome to BsAs.
 
bradlyhale said:
I was going to say... I couldn't even walk around my neighborhood in Quito after dark. We lived in a gated apartment complex (alongside one of Quito's gated housing communities where all of the diplomats lived) in a neighborhood "lleno de pelucones" (their words, not mine).

There they have TV programs dedicated to people calling in to report crimes because people are too scared to call the police. I believe the program was called something like, "Denúncialo."

In Guayaquil, express kidnappings in taxis were a weekly occurrence, sometimes happening 3-5 times a week.

Going out in Quito at night? The nightlife area is patrolled by the military, it seems. I was told that it couldn't even compare to Central America, but still, to see police/military guys walking around with enormous rifles/machine guns? It wasn't very reassuring.

La inseguridad in Argentina is a problem, but I'm afraid that it doesn't hold a candle to many other places around the world.

My experience took place on the McDonalds parking lot across from Parque Ejido, a short distance from the US Embassy in one direction and the Hilton in the other. I would not have wandered around the area at night, even though it was a decent part of town. But in daylight it caught me off guard. I reported it to the police but that was so I could file an insurance claim when I returned to the US. My local friends told me the thieves probably paid off the police for "franchise rights" to the area. The only time they arrested anyone was when some interloper showed up who had not paid for the right to rob people in the area. I have never had an experience like that in BA.
 
Bill.Cochabamba said:
Wow if that bugs you, just wait to you bring up the Falklands. Lol have you seen a world map yet? Welcome to BsAs.

why would anyone have to look at a world map.... oh yeah I almost forgot
 
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