Where else to live?

[Barney]

Everywhere in Europe

 

[marksoc]

Let's go there, how long does it take me to get there and go back to my home in BA and how expensive is the trip by bus, train or combi?

Barney, the price is the same if you live in Buenos Aires or you live next to the restaurant. Is not their fault that you live so far from them.
1:20 hours by car, is a highway almost all the way.

 

[Barney]

No, but it is not really an option is it?

But this is coming from the same guy that says that Thai food in Thailand is cheaper then in BA

 

[sergio]

Can't say I really see the point in questions like this. Different people like different things. One persons nirvana is another persons hellhole. Everybody has to find their own place. Its a big world and plenty of options to chose from.

My personal choice is a place I have already lived, Italy. I lived in a small city in the Northwest corner of the country on the ocean. It has a symphony, an annual musical festival that's quite well known, several opera performances during the year. It was an hours drive to Nice, less to Monaco, drop dead gorgeous scenery. The area has all the culture you could ever want, great food, nice people, good public transportation. We rented an furnished apartment there with an ocean view for 900 euros month. We got health care for about $185 dollars a year. This was about 10 years ago. Prices are probably not a whole lot higher today but the exchange rate of the dollar to the euro is a lot less favorable today. Of all the places I've lived this would be numero ono on places I would consider returning to.

What is the name of this city? Could you PM me as I have some questions about living in Italy. I'd especially like to know about visas and getting into the health care system. Thanks.

 

[sergio]

Berlin, as I've mentioned before. Comparatively cheap rent for a major European city, with all the culture anyone could want. Pretty doggone cold in the winter though.

Cold is what I like. Despise heat and humidity. Have you lived in Berlin? I have heard that it is becoming a major cultural center of Europe with affordable housing.

 

[sergio]

Indeed. There are English-speaking expat sites for almost every major European city one can think of. We'll actually be in that position soon: as of 2012, spending the majority of the year in Europe, with extended trips to Buenos Aires every 6-12 months. We're not looking to move someplace "cheaper" (I think that's just setting yourself up for resentment), but rather a place with better professional opportunities, more stability, and a higher quality of life.

Exactly. Cheaper it may be in central America but steamy Panama does not appeal. The issue is quality of life - stability, a good rail/transport system, history and cultural opportunities, quality of food. If it is expensive like some European capitals it's out of the question but my impression is that there are affordable places in Europe -- and everything is so close. The way it is going Argentina is becoming as expensive as a lot of Europe but without the benefits.

 

[Amargo]

Berlin is great and still cheap for German standards. But property prices have been going up in the last years (I think I read property price increases were the highest in Germany last year).
It has lots to do and it is a great meeting place of western and eastern european culture.
In many neighbourhoods there is quite a lot of dog shit on the streets, specially in those with a very active scene like Prenzlauer Berg or Friedrichshain. So you won't miss BA
The climate is great in summer, VERY cold, windy and wet in winter (-15°C with eastern winds right from Siberia sometimes).
I love the city and would like to live there again, but the Winter is a major negative point.
For those toying with Italy, well, it is mostly even more expensive than Germany, particularly in the North. From a friend living in Brescia I hear that the society is not very open to foreigners and that some people are very racist, even to southern Italians (I never lived in Italy, but travelled there many times).

 

[citygirl]

Thanks Citygirl - I feel we have shared some common ideals and ordeals in this crazy city! To be honest we were always discussing a move back to Europe for a better quality of life and closer proximity to our aging parents in Ireland and Sweden. But as you may recall we were made victims of some pretty scary blackmail last year - so fear for our safety and that of the kids was needless to say a driving force to expedite the move. We sold the house and moved to an anonymous location and with the help of a rather famous penalista we managed to legally stop the attacks just recently...but we will still be looking over our shoulders waiting for a new attack and believe we will be happier and safer in Europe but visiting Argentina regularly. To be honest knowing Im leaving BsAs soon has made me fall in love with it all over again...I can only see and remember the great times we have had here so I will be happy to leave on a very high point.

Oh - how awful, I didn't realize you had just recently stopped the attacks. Sounds like the quality of life will be much better in Europe for you, you'll get to spend lots of time with family and hopefully you'll be back a lot for business and visiting (and hey, sometimes I think that's the best way to deal with BsAs - stay here long enough to enjoy it but short enough to avoid the headaches )

 

[Barney]

The way to enjoy Europe on a budget is if you buy in a Dresden or Leipzig suburb, with direct access to the u-bahn.

Dresden and Leipzig offer quite a lot of services and are a lot cheaper then other major cities. Train into Berlin, Frankfurt, München, prague, Vienna, Boedapest, etc. Try spending atleast parts of november to march elsewehere, the other months is pretty good. There is also some pretty nice hiking nearby.

As an non-European your probally run into problems buying but it should be possible, eventhough I think that most Americans living there have dual citizenship.

If you buy now there is also a decent chance you will make a nice profit is you sell in 10/15/20 years, many German companies are moving there because the low property prices and low salaries. You probally must either work on your own(internet?) or be retired because there are no jobs

 

[Amargo]

Leipzig is great! There are a lot of startups and big companies opening factories in the region. It can not be compared to Berlin or Buenos Aires in terms of things to do, but it is a VERY pleasant city with lots of students.