A second quarantine?

Dougie

Registered
We have many parking wardens and police for example with the ability to issue fines for infractions. Instead of focusing on those illegally parked, focus on those not weakening a mask or practicing proper distancing. Have a whatsapp number where people can send photos and make denuncias which may or may not be investigated and result in fine - just like illegal parking. When people start getting heavy fines (like fines that hurt and they will be paying off for a few years...) then they start to learn and pay attention to how they behave in public.
I think this would just further enrage the public and cause more societal conflict. Citizens informing on other citizens for things like not wearing a mask, being to close to someone else or being in too big of a group feels dystopian.

The first wake of Spanish flu was not that bad. The problem was the second and third that killed over 50 million people when the population was 1/10 of todays.
The lockdown worked well in Wuhan. Now they don’t even use face masks.
Argentina and other democratic societies can't get the same amount of compliance as China. The heavy handed tactics wouldn't be accepted here. Nor do they have the resources to do so even if they wanted. In Wuhan, people couldn't even leave to go to the supermarket, everything was delivery. In some cases they welded doors shut. Good luck implementing that in Argentina.
 

antipodean

Registered
I think this would just further enrage the public and cause more societal conflict. Citizens informing on other citizens for things like not wearing a mask, being to close to someone else or being in too big of a group feels dystopian.
While politically it may be unpopular the thing is, we already have exactly that system in place in CABA for parking and traffic infringements, and we also have a toll free number to denounce quarantine violations. Numbers to denounce tax evasion, numbers to denounce general crimes, numbers to denounce noise disturbances etc. Like pretty much any society.

Frankly speaking the public needs to choose one of three options:
1. loose their basic freedoms and stay at home, loosing money in the process
2. follow rules and protocols in public spaces or pay a fine for non-compliance (or some other consequence)
3. risk infection and death of self or others

I just don’t see any magic bullet that doesn’t need some form of compromize on the part of the public. Just asking Argentines nicely to do the right thing never works.
 

Somewhereinba

Registered
Fighting a Chinese super bug for people with no natural immunity was never going to end well - unfortunately there is no good solution in the whole thing. You either completely destroy the economy and create a generation of screwed up paranoid kids, lock everyone inside for a year and take away their freedom of movement and ability to earn an income making them dependent on the Government to live OR you let people chose how to live their life and the risk they are willing to accept. I'll take B please - I have no interest in the Government dictating my life choices when its clear they are corrupt scumbags who steal from the state while preaching about how much they care about peoples health.

Why not ban smoking, why not ban fast food, why not enforce exercise? If I choose to go for a walk around the park thats my right - if you are paranoid of the virus then stay locked inside for the next 3 years until its gone. There is no 'win' where the virus goes away - it's simply not reality so better people start getting used to living with it. 100% Argentina will be the first to completely close international borders - they have a habit of overreacting and looking like absolute idiots while violating their peoples freedoms at the same time. The question is how long will they shut the countries borders down for.... Could be months, could be a year - with these morons you will never know.
 

gracielle

Registered
I just don’t see any magic bullet that doesn’t need some form of compromize on the part of the public. Just asking Argentines nicely to do the right thing never works.
August 1, 2020
Why is it difficult for Argentines to respect the rules? Marcelo Ceberio, a professor of psychology, attributed this kind of behavior to the instability that the country has. "Acting not very supportive of the other is part of the socio cultural," he lamented.
AUDIO: Why is it difficult for Argentines to respect the rules?
Marcelo Ceberio, professor of psychology and director of the Escuela Sistemica Argentina, spoke with Cadena 3 about the fulfillment of norms in the daily life of Argentines and why it is difficult for us as a society to respect them. The specialist referred to all kinds of cases, from traffic rules, urban hygiene and even new ones such as the use of the chinstrap. As Ceberio analyzed, "Argentina is a social, political and economic system, where the only stable thing we have is instability and within that the rules have little validity."....

....When speaking about the behavior of the Argentines before the world, he said that "Maradona's hand in the 86 World Cup is a symptom of what is happening. “All this has to do with what we talk about, when we venerate the transgression and "viveza" that characterized us in the years 76 to 78, the exile of Argentines to Spain, who did not pay rents and then the Europeans made us pay with the nickname of "sudacas”, he raised.

In the context of the coronavirus pandemic, he also focused on why people go out without a chinstrap or find it difficult to respect the recommendation to keep a distance and pointed out that it is because "we do not have a conscience at all."

"Before the pandemic we were circulating for a total and concrete individualism where each one believes that they have to defend their territory, period. There is no consciousness at all, but we are part of a great system where you, it is you, because I, I am me, "he said.

He warned that this is also done from the example and pointed to the lack of heroes to admire in the country. “What happens to us that after 200 years we continue to venerate the heroes of May? In 200 years, how many heroes appeared? This is eloquent and a symptom of the Argentines ”, he reflected.

“Parents are at the crossroads of how we show referential patterns. There are few figures that we can refer to because we find these inconsistencies. How do I put limits on my son, with what frame of reference do I tell him if the million-dollar scams of a government entourage appear on the cover of the newspapers, "he said....
 

Alby

Registered
There is no 'win' where the virus goes away - it's simply not reality so better people start getting used to living with it.
The funny thing, there are several countries in the world where they still hang on to the dream that, once the magical vaccines come to the rescue in a couple of months, they will be able to rejoin the world shortly after without ever having to live with the virus. It's impossible, but that is the fantasy their governments are leading them to believe. And complaint media are yet to publish much that points to the obvious problems that stand in the way of the fantasy. We live in the age where positive spin has become so automatic, so ingrained, that we now believe it instinctively, and anybody that undercuts it becomes ostracized.
 

artisans

Registered
From massive events to individual actions: the experts' explanation for the rise in Covid-19 cases in the last month
Excellent, thorough discussion that also includes forecasts, remedies and the price to be paid for ignoring or not re-implementing the simple basics of protecting ourselves through personal responsibility.
 

Somewhereinba

Registered
Perhaps it´s better to be at the beach where there´s more space to safe distance...


Well, perhaps not...
The worst part of Argentina.. No brain morons who have no concept of how to behave properly.

Can anyone remember the link to aa2000.com.ar that shows the 'approved' flights at future dates - I was using it back in April/May when repatriation was occurring. With the 30% reduction in capacity I just want to make sure the flight I book has been approved.
 

antipodean

Registered
The worst part of Argentina.. No brain morons who have no concept of how to behave properly.

Can anyone remember the link to aa2000.com.ar that shows the 'approved' flights at future dates - I was using it back in April/May when repatriation was occurring. With the 30% reduction in capacity I just want to make sure the flight I book has been approved.
There are no more "approved" flight lists since all flights are now regular scheduled flights and not "special" flights (as during the quarantine last year)

Best advice is just to check with the airline directly and also give yourself the flexibility to deal with unexpected changes if travelling during this pandemic given the fluidity of the situation globally. For example, as another poster has done, if booking separate connecting tickets make sure your connecting flight is a flexible fare as if affected by a change on your EZE-XXX segment, the airline would likely just put you on a flight a day earlier or later.
 

SVBA_97

Registered
The worst part of Argentina.. No brain morons who have no concept of how to behave properly.

Can anyone remember the link to aa2000.com.ar that shows the 'approved' flights at future dates - I was using it back in April/May when repatriation was occurring. With the 30% reduction in capacity I just want to make sure the flight I book has been approved.
Here it as although I’m sure if/when they want to cut they just will.
 
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