Another Mass Shooting In The Us...

[StevePalermo]

No, not a libertarian! I've been called a fascist by some genuine communists (a friend is the partner of the ex chairman of the Marxist-Leninist Party of GB.. what a nutter she was) and a communist by some BNP members I knew (British National Party - a UK racist party) so I suppose I'm somewhere in the middle. Slightly to the right of left of centre as I'd put it. Very liberal socially but a bit conservative fiscally.

I'm not running away from replying, but have to go out now, someone's waiting. Later.

 

[StevePalermo]

And I'm a militant atheist too.

 

[ElQueso]

I chuckled a bit when I read your last post. Not in an evil way, but I was thinking about what most of my friends here say: "I'm socially liberal but fiscally conservative". That also describes a friend of mine who claims to be libertarian, but isn't really - he's Republican through-and-through, just doesn't like the far right-wing church-going fanatics. I actually used to describe myself the same way, I just have had so many issues with government over the years that I've passed beyond redemption

I am too cynical these days to believe that humans will ever government themselves through actual government in anything approaching a civil manner.

 

[StevePalermo]

That number of humans killed (18 - 20 million) applies to the number killed in wars and military action overseas surely? I'd say that would be outside the parameters of a debate about gun laws within the USA, but if anyone starts a thread on US imperialism I'd probably contribute.

Comparing deaths from automobile and guns, I would say that the difference is that the car industry willingly adopts safety measures to reduce the dangers. Airbags for instance. I don't see the gun industry adopting any measures that would improve public safety, and actively bribes politicians to ensure that no safety legislation is passed.

This is a a good summary of state laws regarding gun safety http://smartgunlaws.org/gun-laws/policy-areas/consumer-child-safety/safe-storage-gun-locks/. Looks like some states are far safer (or unsafer depending on your point of view) than others.

And as for banning automobiles... even as a passionate advocate of public transport as a more economically efficient and environmentally friendly method, I wouldn't agree with that. With the lack of alternatives it wouldn't be practical and it would be an infringement of liberties too far (is any acceptable do I hear you say!). I used to cycle 10 miles each way to work, but that was by choice not necessity. But restricting guns, yes. I really believe that we are safer without them in public ownership, but we'll never agree on that. We come from different cultures.

I've had a couple of near-death experiences and was thankful for the national health care system that cared for me, and once definitely saved my life, I didn't want to imply that anyone is refused care in the last instance, but for many illnesses early detection is imperative and life saving. There's plenty of evidence that people have died because they couldn't get early treatment. I'd say that just turning up to the ER department isn't the best way of dealing with the problem. I haven't investigated the problem to the extent that you have, but I was under the impression that more people have coverage under the ACA than previously. A family I've known for many years went bankrupt about 20 years ago because their son couldn't get coverage, but I believe that young people can get coverage under their parents' policy these days. I could be wrong. What I do know is that people I know who've lived under the US system and the British one prefer the British one by far, especially people with kids. But that is just anecdotal evidence, the kind that I usually criticise!

I'm not saying that the ACA is a great piece of legislation, a national health system would be far better. There are pros and cons. http://www.healthline.com/health/consumer-healthcare-guide/pros-and-cons-obamacare#Pros2

Are only conservatives capable of propaganda? No, everyone can, but conservatives just do it more than anyone else. From my perspective of course! And finally, regarding car insurance. The problem with not having it and the feasibility of the driver paying for damage caused is that the driver often can't pay. What if catastrophic injuries are caused and the victim needs lifelong care? I'd say that not paying for your own insurance only puts the burden on the rest of the community.

I think we've gone well off topic. And my freedom to spend time on the internet is going to be severely limited in the next few days from the look on my girlfriend's face as I'm writing this. I'd better go.

 

[StevePalermo]

I chuckled a bit when I read your last post. Not in an evil way, but I was thinking about what most of my friends here say: "I'm socially liberal but fiscally conservative". That also describes a friend of mine who claims to be libertarian, but isn't really - he's Republican through-and-through, just doesn't like the far right-wing church-going fanatics. I actually used to describe myself the same way, I just have had so many issues with government over the years that I've passed beyond redemption

I am too cynical these days to believe that humans will ever government themselves through actual government in anything approaching a civil manner.

One last post for the day. I'd probably vote Democrat just to keep out Trump. A disgusting monster of a person. And I'm the eternal optimist, I think we can have a reasonable government. And to be facetious for a moment, If people don't like government they should try Somalia, not a lot of government there!

 

[camberiu]

And to be facetious for a moment, If people don't like government they should try Somalia, not a lot of government there!

 

[StevePalermo]

camberiu,

Wow, that's new, I've never seen that argument before! With that one picture you've just convinced me that all the independent research and other arguments have no merit. Thanks for putting me right!

 

[camberiu]

camberiu,

Wow, that's new, I've never seen that argument before! With that one picture you've just convinced me that all the independent research and other arguments have no merit. Thanks for putting me right!

Great. I take it that you mean that you will never use that stupid Somalia argument ever again, right?

 

[Ries]

my dad grew up on the south side of chicago.
he never needed a gun.
I have friends who live there now- and dont carry guns.
In fact, the Obama family used to live in the South Side, before he got elected.
I have spent time there- and, if you are not trying to buy drugs, most people get along just fine.
One of the greatest swap meets of all time is in the South Side- Maxwell Street. Not as good as it used to be, but still worth going to every sunday that you are in Chicago.
I bought my first anvil there for fifty bucks.

 

[StevePalermo]

Great. I take it that you mean that you will never use that stupid Somalia argument ever again, right?

Did you not read the full post? I said I was being facetious. From your previous posts I shouldn't be surprised that you don't know what that means.