Drones For Tax Evaders

[Joe]

So Steve, if the Pubs win the next presidential election the drone murders will stop?

This is not an issue of who is president in the US. Both parties are equally corrupted and captured vassals of the evil empire and the Military Industrial Complex

That being said, I remember that based on one of those great polls, the least popular topic on this forum is American politics. Maybe this off topic discussion of the USA Drone Murders should be continued in the World Politics forum.

 

[steveinbsas]

So Steve, if the Pubs win the next presidential election the drone murders will stop?

They could if a Constitutional Conservative is nominated and wins...and acts within the powers granted by the Constitution...nada mas.

This is not an issue of who is president in the US.

If it isn't the issue in 2016, it may never be again.

Both parties are equally corrupted vassals of the evil empire and the Military Industrial Complex

Not quite equal, at least not yet and wont be if the present Republican leadership (two men in particular) are replaced by a newly elected majority in both the the Senate and House. That can only happen with a "sequel" whose results surpass the outcome of the 2010 elections.

That being said, I remember that based on one of those great polls, the least popular topic on this forum is American politics. Maybe the discussion should be continued in the World Politics forum.

When new posts in the World Politics Forum appear in the "latest posts" list on the home page I will be happy to do so.

PS: I did not introduce the subject of the murderous U.S. done strikes in this thread, but I was happy to take advantage of the opportunity to reply to Jose's post with information which other members may never have read about.

 

[HeyHeyJose]

Random?

Yes random, as in anything that moves, anyone who is in a certain area, any person who moves/behaves in certain way. Their names are not known. This has been fully document even in "news" channels like cnn, msnb, fox et al.

Just picked up this story of 8 people killed by drones that exemplifies what "random" means.

http://www.policymic.com/articles/89135/8-stories-of-civilians-killed-by-u-s-drone-strikes-in-yemen

I don't recommend anyone watching CNN but some still like to read "corporate news". Either way they also talked about it.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/09/25/world/asia/pakistan-us-drone-strikes/

 

[HeyHeyJose]

This is a short clip of the interview where Michael Hayden, former head of NSA, says that indeed they "kill people based on metadata", and goes in a short explanation of how that works.

In a parallel universe this man would've been handcuffed and arrested immediately, why not on this one?

http://youtu.be/UdQiz0Vavmc

 

[PhilipDT]

Meanwhile back at the White House every Tuesday morning for over half a decade, President Obama sits with key members of his security council, CIA and military intelligence to hand pick his next drone victims.
...Clearly Obama sees it as his ordained right to be able to personally cherry pick his drone victims on a weekly matter-of-fact basis..."

That certainly doesn't sound "random" to me.

Which is, I think, what ghost was trying to say.

 

[EdRooney]

Bureau of Investigative Journalism reports over 2400 civilians killed by drones. So if they were not randomly killed, that would mean they were targeted, and targeting civilians is a war crime for which leaders were hanged at Nuremburg.

Are you accusing Obama, Bush, Cameron et al of deliberately targeting civilians? If so, would you be in favour of applying the same measure to them as the Allies applied to their defeated WWII enemies?

 

[steveinbsas]

Bureau of Investigative Journalism reports over 2400 civilians killed by drones. So if they were not randomly killed, that would mean they were targeted, and targeting civilians is a war crime for which leaders were hanged at Nuremburg.

Are you accusing Obama, Bush, Cameron et al of deliberately targeting civilians? If so, would you be in favour of applying the same measure to them as the Allies applied to their defeated WWII enemies?

The Allies deliberately targeted hundreds of thousands of civilians in Wold War II.

Ever hear about the bombing of Tokyo or Dresden (among others)?

That's the way war was waged then.

The Nazi war crimes involved mostly non-military deaths of millions of civilians.

Even if Obama is not deliberately targeting civilians, he must be aware of the fact that a staggering number of civilians are killed (on aveage) for every "terrorist" taken out by a drone strike:

"A Stanford-New York University study determined that the dual drone attack program in Pakistan kills just one terrorist for every 50 fatalities. This double tap drone coldly fires upon rescuers tending to victims of the first drone attack murdering 49 innocent humans for every one intended terrorist killed. This wholesale slaughter is unconscionable.

Nor does it even matter to our President that the murdered victims may be American citizens. Obama stated arrogantly that he could one day foresee killing Americans on American soil. Recall in September 2011 the Islamic American citizen Anwar al Awlaki deemed an enemy sympathizer in Yemen who died with another American Moslem and then two weeks later his own sixteen year old son from Colorado was targeted and murdered along with his several friends while dining in a remote Yemen village. While embedded mainstream press never dared to press the president on these cold-blooded killings, his press secretary responded by callously blaming the dead sixteen year old boy for “choosing the wrong parents.”

http://www.globalresearch.ca/us-terrorism-from-the-skies-the-truth-behind-drone-strikes-as-the-presidents-personal-choice-of-warfare/5382279

 

[EdRooney]

I'm not trying to justify the how justice was applied after WWII (if you look, Japanese commanders were deliberately left off the hook for crimes the court knew could be shown to have been also committed by the allies).

The point here is different. It's basic minimal morality: if we apply a rule of law to our enemies, we should also apply at the very least that same measure to ourselves. What is the accusation against Assad, Qaddafi, Milosevic... Deliberately killing civilians. If I understand Ghost and Philip, they are implying that Obama & co. are guilty of the same crimes.

 

[HeyHeyJose]

That certainly doesn't sound "random" to me.

It is hard to digest at first but our US government is busy killing women, children and men to right and left. The evidence of these atrocities is overwhelming to anyone wanting to learn about it.

Some highlights from this NBC article below about killing unknown human beings at random:

An NBC News review of classified CIA documents for a 14 month period beginning in September 2010 lists 114 drone strikes that killed as many as 613 people. However, in some of those strikes, the CIA did not know the identity of the victims.

(...)picking targets based in part on their behavior and associates. A former White House official said the U.S. sometimes executes people based on “circumstantial evidence.”

In some cases, U.S. officials also seem unsure how many people died. One entry says that a drone attack killed seven to 10 people, while another says that an attack killed 20 to 22.



http://investigations.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/06/05/18781930-cia-didnt-always-know-who-it-was-killing-in-drone-strikes-classified-documents-show?lite

 

[steveinbsas]

The Nazi war crimes involved mostly non-military deaths of millions of civilians.

Of course the SS (who executed millions of civilians) was a branch of the military. I would edit this post and change "non-military" to "non-combatant" if I could, but the time allowed to edit the post has expired.