Gay Marriage in Agentina

[Matt84]

You got that right.. if you look at how society deals with this issue in general, it is pathedic. The openess of mind is not there yet and it does without a doubt cause human suffering in so many ways. But Society does not care, in fact it is, in many ways ruthless. As I am sure you well know.

So what is wrong with me understanding and accepting the facts about all this, not as a bigot, wanting to sheild my children from all the complexities associated with this at this time in the history of humanity?

I understand that you have issues to deal with in society in general.. but the smothest path for children is one that does not include these difficluties unless it is completely unaviodbale and nessicary before they have reached a ligitimate age to deal with these things in their thinking and in society.

Which whether we like it or not, this is the society we have at this time.. yes it is chaging? Slowly yes, but changing and that is a good thing. I celebrate with you the right to be married and many other changes that have and are slowly coming about.

But concerning children in our current societies IMHO it is better to let them develop without confronting issues as complex and ruthless as these in our society at this time.

We can debate it from every angle, but 5 years old minds are not ready for this, in this society. Most adults can not even deal with this in our societies. As I said, I am sorry, I wish it was other wise but it is not.

Hold on, you are an adult, you can be or not be a bigot yourself, seems like not. But you are not only free but responsible NOT to expose your children to excessive sex or violence. So I agree 100% with you on that - I just don't see the relation with legislation.
That's just another law of nature, children are better off if they are somewhat protected from what they'll anyway have to face later on. !

 

[Saturnine]

And while I support gay marriage and equal rights.. let's be frank and honest. The nature of creation and reproduction points clearly to the fact that there is something out of context with homosexuality that does not fit into the context of natural. If all of humanity was gay the human race could possibly be extinct in 100 years...

Yes, let's be frank and honest, Tom
Lots of things have changed over the last few decades and it appears that, as usual, there was a larger change of discourse and a smaller shift of attitude. "Pro-natural" is just a PC way of saying the same as before gay rights movements, except you're focused on the positive instead of saying you're against something. It used to be homosexuality was "contra natura". Now we're saying heterosexuality is "pro-natural". Go figure. I would have thought open-mindedness is not restricted to saying straight is natural, gay is not.
Nature is larger than discourse, Tom. The argument about the world facing extinction if everyone was gay is, to say the least, outdated. Because there's no risk of it happening, gay marriage laws or not Homosexuality has always been present, statistically, but acceptance won't make it turn into the mainstream orientation some heterosexuals like to fear.
Nature is having problems surviving due to overpopulation for the moment, so I guess there's really no danger of extinction due to sexual preference right now, is there?

If I have a child or even a friend that has tendency towards this lifestyle I want to limit that as much as possible. Not because I am antigay... I am pro natural. And honestly looking at the number of gay men .. NOT ALL .. I have seen living tormented confused lives. I want to limit the potential for this tormented confused state of being as mush as possible. Whether it is personal or social its just matter of fact.

And you're right. Many gays do have tormented or confused lives. But many do not just because they're gay, but rather because others torment or confuse them by continuously stressing the liabilities of being gay. How comfortable would you feel in a different community, always being frowned upon?
I've thought - as many have, probably - about the chances of my child coming up one day and telling me he/she is gay. And yes, I'd probably suffer imagining what he/she will have to cope with. That's why I can only hope society will learn to deal with it in a better way. If you don't want that potential burden on your kids, when they're adults, do yourself a favor and don't fall into the steps of thousands of others who think "gay is ok, but it doesn't have to be." It would be pretty embarrassing, as a wiser grown-up, to face your teenage or adult offspring and say: "Well, now, I'm ok with you being gay, but it would sure make things easier if you weren't."
It would, but that's hardly the point, is it?

You want our respect and acceptance no problem on my end.. just respect that fact that we can and do make children. You can not and do not. Just like your are different we are different, in that we reproduce and have these little humans called kids they are very very important to us! And we have many issues to deal with in raising these little crazy humans we call our kids.

Now, I don't know where you get your information from, but the last time I checked, gay people can and do make children. And not all of them resort to IVF or surrogate mothers. While two men or two women cannot "live and multiply" together, there's much to be said about people's desire to have progeny. That's not gay or straight, it's just downright human.
If you take a minute to think about it, that's what I'm trying to say, awkwardly maybe, considering the early hour: it's all about being human

 

[marksoc]

If somebody came to Buenos Aires looking for a religious and conservative society, you are in the wrong place. Try Mendoza, where locals think that homosexuality is a sickness (you see, they are too close to Chile).

 

[AnalogDreamer]

Tom, you know, 5 year old can be gay themselves. It is very very positive that they will be exposed to homosexual coupling as a valid choice since they are young.
you say you are not a bigot?

 

[citygirl]

We can debate it from every angle, but 5 years old minds are not ready for this, in this society. Most adults can not even deal with this in our societies. As I said, I am sorry, I wish it was other wise but it is not.

Actually, most little kids I know deal with the issue a lot better than "adults". Kids don't care whether its 2 men, 2 women or a man and a woman because they haven't learned yet that anything outside the norm is to be considered scary.

My nieces and nephews (of which I have 11 and counting) are not even remotely scandalized by their classmates who have 2 moms or dads. Or by their classmates who are being raised by only 1 parent. Or those who are being raised by a stay-at-home dad. Or any other "non-traditional" household. It's simply not an issue to them. They could give a lot of adults I know a lesson on how to deal with this.

And as for not wanting to explain?? Seriously? Life is full of difficult things to explain to a child in Argentina (or anywhere) - abuse, abandoned animals, violence, robberies, losing a job or a home. I hardly would put explaining that two people of the same sex love each other in that category

FWIW - from my repressed Yankee heritage , I'm not particularly comfortable with excessive public displays of affection between ANY couple of any persuasion. Hand-holding, a kiss, or such - no problem. Full on makeout sessions - ick. But that's me.