Land Grabs And Squatters

[dennisr]

For laws passed by the legislatura de la ciudad?

Indeed, however, my argument is K controls the purse strings for about everything and anything in the country. There is suppose to be a degree of revenue sharing throughout the country between the feds and provincial/city governments. If a particular entity opposes K in any way shape or form, funds are withheld and projects like "football for all" are funded.

 

[citygirl]

It's been quite a problem around us. There are still lots next to the highway/near the hightway that are more or less undeveloped. Technically as long as there is a fence around them, no one can enter. They are all fenced however what happens is the squatters come at night and cut the fence down with wirecutters. Then the wait a day or two and if no one notices, they move right in and put up very temp housing (think fabric over poles). However, once there is any type of roof on, it's next to impossible to remove them without reaching an accord (pay off).

They don't seem to have any intention of really staying, they just take the money and go. A few months later, it happens all over again.

Anyone remember when it happened on Godoy Cruz about 2 years ago?

The property behind us which is in the process of being developed has hired a guy to stay there at night with a gun.

 

[PhilipDT]

Argentina has a huge problem covering one of the most important human rights, the right of housing.
Because of multiple factors, theres a growing situation called "emergencia habitacional". Basically more and more people come from poorer countries and poorer zones of the country to the city to live in villas and asentamientos.
The State has to manage this, as a country who signed and ratified the compromise of safeguard this human right.
Its a complex situation, I know pretty well this government has constructed lots of houses. My maid, Viviana, who was a cartonera back in 2001, recieved a new house, with 2 bedrooms and a yard, with ESCRITURA, with ESCRIBANO. When a storm blew its roof out then the government fixed that situation.

Like her, there are thousands, but the situation in spite of improving is getting worse and worse every year.

People on the indoamericano had the promisse of a decent roof, and until they dont get it, it seems they will continue doing this.

The problem with all of this Right to Housing crap is that people like matias and these squatter's and their advocates interpret it completely differently than the way most sane people do. Which is that people have the right to earn a wage which allows them to have "a standard of living adequate for the health and well-being of himself and of his family, including food, clothing, housing and medical care and necessary social services" and if they cannot, due to injury, illness or disability that the state will provide the aforementioned benefits. The obligation of the state is to set a minimum wage that allows people to obtain such standard of living.

Sane people realize that it does not mean that everyone has the same access to food, housing and medical care. Free breast enlargement surgery is not a human right (sorry ceviche), nor are fresh truffles to garnish your foie gras, nor having a mansion overlooking the riviera.

Yet for some reason people like Matias seem to believe basic human rights means the right to eat premium food (carne para todos), watch satellite tv(http://goo.gl/BRw8an) with free sports programing (futbol para todos) in your over air-conditioned home (http://goo.gl/os6VLX), and live in the most expensive city in the country.

Remember many if not most of these people who are out there clamoring for free houses were not previously sleeping on the sidewalk; they had homes or living options in Boliva, Paraguay, Peru, etc. They came here voluntarily, and why not? Higher wages plus free houses? Doesn't sound like too bad of an offer.

This 'give them everything and expect nothing' attitude from the left really irritates my sense of right and wrong, especially when I think of my girlfriend. My girlfriend is one of the most admirable people I know. She was born in a one of these neighboring countries and as a toddler was brought to Buenos Aires by her parents, she grew up in a building which was 'tomado' and run by small time gangsters. A single teen mom before finishing high school, it would have been so much easier for her to move in to the villa, get on a 'plan social' and wait for a free house. She was certainly surrounded by people who did so. Instead she finished school and worked her way through a public university program, she went in to what by all rights should have been the best career pathway into the middle class. It worked too, for a while. Unfortunately due to macroeconomic policy decisions light years beyond her control, the promising industry she went into was neatly pushed out of the country and 10% indec based inflation adjustments just barely slowed the decrease in her purchasing power. She often works incredibly long hours and is constantly striving for excellence in her work for which she garners lots of recognition but little renumeration - billions of dollars of forex intervention has made sure there's no extra money to give. She constantly worries about paying the rent on her tiny and tired apartment, and has many times gone hungry to do so. Real hunger, $6 pesos a day hunger. She's compared it to being on a treadmill, running as fast as you can against 30% and increasing inflation, as fast as you run and as hard as you work moving forward is neigh impossible and as tired as you get, sprinting to keep up with prices, you can never relax, you can never even maintain the same quick pace, because if you do, you're sliding right back into poverty. For the icing on the cake, when she finally arrive home and goes to check the news online (no tv), she gets to see masses of people who don't work, who aren't out there sweating blood every day just to put food on the table, many of whom don't look like they've ever missed a meal, protesting the fact that they don't get to live in one of the costliest cities in South America for free.

Decada Ganada indeed.

 

[odyssea]

The Right to Healthcare is indeed a "slippery slope". How can a government deliver high end care (or even sufficient) care when monies allocated for infrastructure and staff is inadequate. Basic public health is even at risk. There is, however, a faulty assumption that the government owes all, and there needs no co-responsibility, either as payment of taxes or premiums for health insurance. This is the flaw, and it is difficult to see a reasonable resolution.

 

[odyssea]

Indeed, however, my argument is K controls the purse strings for about everything and anything in the country. There is suppose to be a degree of revenue sharing throughout the country between the feds and provincial/city governments. If a particular entity opposes K in any way shape or form, funds are withheld and projects like "football for all" are funded.

It is a lot easier to give people football to watch than to have them on the streets protesting. The Romans used gladiatorial games for that purpose.

 

[syngirl]

This is not the first time this has happened -- you can read a thread about the takeover in 2010. I think Matias said previously in this thread that the new takeover is because the govt hasn't resolved these claims for land. However, I dont know -- last time once the payouts were given people disappeared from the park extraordinarily rapidly. There's a lot of dirty work going on as well -- it's not that the people going in there division off their squat and start building -- no, they actually hand over money to some headhoncho guys. There's a lot of people being taken advantage of and a lot of empty promises made. To be honest, last time it happened I was much more on the ball about the goings on, this time I haven't had a chance to keep up with it on the news so much so don't feel I can offer too informed of an opinion. Will have to have more of a read.

Here's the thread about the takeover in 2010: http://baexpats.org/topic/11976-villa-soldati-are-you-watching/page__hl__indoamericana

 

[EricLovesBA]

Crap. I had grabbed my notebook, pencil, coffee - I was all ready for a how-to thread!

 

[ajoknoblauch]

Adequate food and housing for everybody is much easier to advocate than to achieve. Circuses like Fútbol para Todos, though, distract many of those who suffer from hunger and homelessness.

 

[pauper]

Indeed, however, my argument is K controls the purse strings for about everything and anything in the country.

The K's control the purse strings for CABA? Can I have source with that?

Those laws were passed something like 9 years ago next to nothing has happened, I'm not aware there was any federal element in the funding.

 

[Matiasba]

The problem with all of this Right to Housing crap is that people like matias and these squatter's and their advocates interpret it completely differently than the way most sane people do. Which is that people have the right to earn a wage which allows them to have "a standard of living adequate for the health and well-being of himself and of his family, including food, clothing, housing and medical care and necessary social services" and if they cannot, due to injury, illness or disability that the state will provide the aforementioned benefits. The obligation of the state is to set a minimum wage that allows people to obtain such standard of living.

Sane people realize that it does not mean that everyone has the same access to food, housing and medical care. Free breast enlargement surgery is not a human right (sorry ceviche), nor are fresh truffles to garnish your foie gras, nor having a mansion overlooking the riviera.

Yet for some reason people like Matias seem to believe basic human rights means the right to eat premium food (carne para todos), watch satellite tv(http://goo.gl/BRw8an) with free sports programing (futbol para todos) in your over air-conditioned home (http://goo.gl/os6VLX), and live in the most expensive city in the country.

Remember many if not most of these people who are out there clamoring for free houses were not previously sleeping on the sidewalk; they had homes or living options in Boliva, Paraguay, Peru, etc. They came here voluntarily, and why not? Higher wages plus free houses? Doesn't sound like too bad of an offer.

This 'give them everything and expect nothing' attitude from the left really irritates my sense of right and wrong, especially when I think of my girlfriend. My girlfriend is one of the most admirable people I know. She was born in a one of these neighboring countries and as a toddler was brought to Buenos Aires by her parents, she grew up in a building which was 'tomado' and run by small time gangsters. A single teen mom before finishing high school, it would have been so much easier for her to move in to the villa, get on a 'plan social' and wait for a free house. She was certainly surrounded by people who did so. Instead she finished school and worked her way through a public university program, she went in to what by all rights should have been the best career pathway into the middle class. It worked too, for a while. Unfortunately due to macroeconomic policy decisions light years beyond her control, the promising industry she went into was neatly pushed out of the country and 10% indec based inflation adjustments just barely slowed the decrease in her purchasing power. She often works incredibly long hours and is constantly striving for excellence in her work for which she garners lots of recognition but little renumeration - billions of dollars of forex intervention has made sure there's no extra money to give. She constantly worries about paying the rent on her tiny and tired apartment, and has many times gone hungry to do so. Real hunger, $6 pesos a day hunger. She's compared it to being on a treadmill, running as fast as you can against 30% and increasing inflation, as fast as you run and as hard as you work moving forward is neigh impossible and as tired as you get, sprinting to keep up with prices, you can never relax, you can never even maintain the same quick pace, because if you do, you're sliding right back into poverty. For the icing on the cake, when she finally arrive home and goes to check the news online (no tv), she gets to see masses of people who don't work, who aren't out there sweating blood every day just to put food on the table, many of whom don't look like they've ever missed a meal, protesting the fact that they don't get to live in one of the costliest cities in South America for free.

Decada Ganada indeed.

I can make this longer, but I wont.

Basically, my point, that you dont get, is that these people deserve a decent place to live. Does not matter if they earned it or not, if they work(ed) for it. They deserve it just because they are poor, because they are the lower strata, the most vulnerable people, the people with less rights, the people who live in worst conditions, the hardests lives. Thats why the deserve a decent life independently if they earned it or not.

And BTW Im not sure if the housing programmes give a totally free house. I think theres some kind of accesible mortage, like 1000 pesos/month, especially made for these people.