Mauricio Macri ... Next President Of Argentina

[sesamosinsal]

And so when Macri talks about ending the cepo on the first day, what excites people is not the devaluation itself, which in and of itself may indeed be painful and perhaps unwise. It is rather his promise, his explicit promise, to stop lying. If the net result is that the economy and the government's revenue systems become more normal, everybody understands that it's well worth it. If that doesn't happen, of course, that's a different story.

To stop lying about what precisely? (He is a politician, you know.)

It's not entirely clear, and I'd rather not jump to conclusions before formulating a response.

 

[Matiasba]

The main difference between Macri and Scioli is that with the Ks, and probably with Scioli, governs the POLITICAL power, chosen by the citizenship, while with Macri governs the ECONOMICAL power, the concentrated capital groups that provoked several crisis, coups, dictatorships, hyperinflation, etc, those who were, for the first time in decades, out of the ministeries decisions, of big economic decisions.

 

[ben]

To stop lying about what precisely? (He is a politician, you know.)

It's not entirely clear, and I'd rather not jump to conclusions before formulating a response.

Of course I understand Macri is a politician. I have already said that I don't think he's any saint. I do think bajo's aspersions are more smoke and mirrors than substance, and his repeated refusal to give details when asked strengthens this conviction. But saint? Hardly.

When I refer to honesty, I mean it in the most general sense possible, that the government will largely do what it says and say what it does. That if they plan on leaving the cepo in place for 10 months, they will say so. That they won't say that there is no cepo, or any other such device, when there clearly is one. That the government gives the impression of not working behind people's backs. That government pronouncements will not ring endlessly hollow or false. That meaningful steps be taken to combat corruption, both in government and in society at large.

I understand that Macri is a wealthy man, and therefore have grounds for hope that his impetus for entering government may not be personal enrichment. That he sees how reviled the current government is among anybody with a brain, and wants to take steps to ensure that his might not share the same fate. His current pronouncements sound mature, he seems to want to raise the level of discourse a notch or two. That is what I mean by 'not lying'.

 

[AmigoArtistico]

The main difference between Macri and Scioli is that with the Ks, and probably with Scioli, governs the POLITICAL power, chosen by the citizenship, while with Macri governs the ECONOMICAL power, the concentrated capital groups that provoked several crisis, coups, dictatorships, hyperinflation, etc, those who were, for the first time in decades, out of the ministeries decisions, of big economic decisions.

Matias, you forgot to take your medication again.

 

[Matiasba]

Matias, you forgot to take your medication again.

lack of arguments?

 

[sesamosinsal]

Ben, thanks for the clarification. I have to disagree that corruption ends with Macri, and that he will "do what he says."

On the first point, there is a lot of corruption in the city, such as Niembrogate, corrupt inspection agents who shakedown small shops, etc. Taking on corruption is a worthwhile fight, but I honestly don't share your optimism that future Niembrogates, Boudougates, etc. won't occur under the ingeniero. We may achieve corrupción cero when ElQueso becomes president and dissolves every branch of government.

On the second point, Macri has flipped on almost every issue:

1) He didn't support the Universal Child Credit. Now he does.
2) He didn't support Fúbtol Para Todos. Now he does.
3) He didn't support marriage equality. Now he does.
4) He didn't support the nationalization of YPF. Now he does.
5) He didn't support the nationalization of AA. Now he does.

(He flipped on fútbol para todos for God's sake...)

Here's a nice little list of laws he's vetoed as mayor:

• Ley 2566: Creación de Laboratorio Estatal de Producción de Medicamentos.
• Ley 3107: Acceso a la información pública sobre empesas y sociedades del Estado (veto parcial).
• Ley 3268: Creación del Registro de Ex Presos Políticos.
• Ley 3298: Creación del Comité contra la Tortura y Otros Tratos o Penas Crueles.
• Ley 3299: Otorgamiento de subsidios a la Asamblea permanente por los Derechos Humanos.
• Ley 3329: Creación de un Fondo para la localización y restitución de niños en cautiverio
• Ley 3369: Creación de una oficina contra la trata de personas.
• Ley 3721: Programa de inclusión Laboral para Jóvenes en situación de Vulnerabilidad Social.
• Ley 4061: Creación de un fondo fiduciario para mini pymes y empresas recuperadas.
• Ley 4075: Incorporación de la fertilización asistida a la cobertura de Obsba.
• Ley 4094: Otorgamiento de un subsidio de 50 mil pesos a la Asociación Sindrome de Down.

... and there's more at La Nación, published in 2012 when he wasn't campaigning for president.

This guy's discourse has done a complete 180 for the campaign. Scioli, like him or not, has been much more consistent. Furthermore, the people around him also want to get out of the cepo, but not through a massive increase in interest rates and devaluation that will kill the domestic economy.

 

[Rich One]

The main difference between Macri and Scioli is that with the Ks, and probably with Scioli, governs the POLITICAL power, chosen by the citizenship, while with Macri governs the ECONOMICAL power, the concentrated capital groups that provoked several crisis, coups, dictatorships, hyperinflation, etc, those who were, for the first time in decades, out of the ministries decisions, of big economic decisions.

Mati want to hear your speech next Monday if Macri is elected by more than 50 % of the PEOPLE..... All Corporations...??

 

[ben]

@Bradly -

I'm in a bit of a rush, so I won't go point by point. Here's off the top of my head:

- Macri freely admits to having flip-flopped. He presents it as a sign of growth. I tend to regard such an admission as a mitigating factor, and reserve judgment until I see if it is blatant vote-buying, or something more mature. There's a video on YouTube, definitely worth watching, where Tim Cook puts forth Steve Jobs' capacity to flip-flop as one of his greatest strengths. Flip-flopping is definitely something to watch, and watch out for, but does not necessarily meet the bar of 'lying' in the sense I'm using it in this thread.

- There's a big difference between not wanting to have done something in the first place, and accepting it as a fait accompli. This is precisely his stated reasoning regarding FPT, and possibly (not sure) regarding Aerolineas and YPF. Compare with Scioli, who defended Menem's privatizations and now threatens Macri doing the same - without the slightest hint that he ever thought differently.

- Regarding stuff Macri vetoed. While it undeniably had good results, there is certainly the perception - I never went deep enough to get proofs - of this government dealing with history to the exclusion of improving the present, and in some cases - say, Malvinas - simply to distract attention from disastrous moments.
Recall all the mini-scandals that aren't even being discussed now, but which all helped shape our perception of K government. The assertion that books from abroad would be held by customs on account of the lead content of the ink. Boudou/Ciccone. Etc.
Many of the commissions etc. would in the best case be distractions from actual governing, and in the worst case would be the tools for further power grabs. Examples on your list would be ex presos politicos, permanent assembly for human rights (huh?), a state medical laboratory (sounds like a favor to someone), etc.

Could some of the stuff have been motivated by partisan politics? Sure.
With all that, does one still have grounds for hope that electing him will be a massive improvement over Scioli and more K government? Yes.

 

[Bajo_cero2]

To be "procesado" means to be indicted; he hasn't been "condenado".

But hey, Macri joins Boudou, and of course there's Menem who has actually been condenado but is protected by legislative immunity...

All those on the forum thinking we're going to get change with Macri. Haha. That's cute.

Not exactly. Macri is indicated in over 200 criminal case but in the illegal phone tapping, the case passed the grand jury and is is waiting for the trial.

 

[Bajo_cero2]

Mati want to hear your speech next Monday if Macri is elected by more than 50 % of the PEOPLE..... All Corporations...??

What he means is that Macri us going to rule for corporations not for the people.
He wants a ceo of Monanto at the agriculture office, a ceo of LAN at aerolineas, a ceo of shell at YPF.
Devaluation makes more profits for companies are poorer the whole country.
To open importations is going to destroy 500.000 jobs plus the usd to pay them, do they grow in the trees?