Price of meat will skyrocket

[sts7049]

that cant be true. its already a guarantee that milei has ruined everything.

 

[Quilombo]

Saying time will tell and I hope for best isn't good enough. Poorest people have to be protected at all costs needed. They did not cause the situation, but they are already sacrificing the most.

This is what I find frustrating about the Mileistas here, elsewhere online, and in real life. It's easy to be pro adjustment when you either have dollars or a wealthy family, but for the people on the margins of society it was bad with Alberto and it's still getting worse.

Where has the caste been hit exactly? Last I could tell they're doing fine and it's the working poor that have seen their incomes and livelihoods (as much as they had any to begin with) subject to lingchi.

People here like to talk about Argentine friends and them generally being okay and supportive of the agenda, but I'm willing to guess these friends come from a very different class than people like my in laws who live in Zona Sur, one rung above a "barrio popular".

Contrary to the hate espoused online, these people aren't "parasites" as Mileistas would have you believe. My SIL is a domestic worker, and cleans the houses of middle class and wealthy Argentines. With the new year "raises" domestic workers earn $1.50/hr. She works 6 days a week while raising her son, taking him to school, and ensuring he is kept busy after class so he doesn't go down a bad path in life. She is the one paying for the adjustment, not the members of this forum or the people who make up Milei's cabinet.

I'm not saying those of us (at least not most of us) on the forum are bad people, but I see so many folks talk about these things in the abstract. The average salary in Argentina was $500 a month according to an article Rich One posted last week, and millions more earn less than this, even when working full time and getting pitiful planes. These people suffered under Alberto, nobody is denying that, but they're suffering even worse now under Milei.

As Mikic said, what good is the chemo if we're just killing the patient? This is what I fear, that the adjustment never comes for us beyond dollar inflation and it's the millions like my SIL who just languish in poverty. She has my husband and I, but is too proud or embarrassed to ask or accept help and feels she shouldn't have to when she works for a living and always has. What do the rest of people do whose family are suffering just like them?

 

[sergio]

This is what I find frustrating about the Mileistas here, elsewhere online, and in real life. It's easy to be pro adjustment when you either have dollars or a wealthy family, but for the people on the margins of society it was bad with Alberto and it's still getting worse.

Where has the caste been hit exactly? Last I could tell they're doing fine and it's the working poor that have seen their incomes and livelihoods (as much as they had any to begin with) subject to lingchi.

People here like to talk about Argentine friends and them generally being okay and supportive of the agenda, but I'm willing to guess these friends come from a very different class than people like my in laws who live in Zona Sur, one rung above a "barrio popular".

Contrary to the hate espoused online, these people aren't "parasites" as Mileistas would have you believe. My SIL is a domestic worker, and cleans the houses of middle class and wealthy Argentines. With the new year "raises" domestic workers earn $1.50/hr. She works 6 days a week while raising her son, taking him to school, and ensuring he is kept busy after class so he doesn't go down a bad path in life. She is the one paying for the adjustment, not the members of this forum or the people who make up Milei's cabinet.

I'm not saying those of us (at least not most of us) on the forum are bad people, but I see so many folks talk about these things in the abstract. The average salary in Argentina was $500 a month according to an article Rich One posted last week, and millions more earn less than this, even when working full time and getting pitiful planes. These people suffered under Alberto, nobody is denying that, but they're suffering even worse now under Milei.

As Mikic said, what good is the chemo if we're just killing the patient? This is what I fear, that the adjustment never comes for us beyond dollar inflation and it's the millions like my SIL who just languish in poverty. She has my husband and I, but is too proud or embarrassed to ask or accept help and feels she shouldn't have to when she works for a living and always has. What do the rest of people do whose family are suffering just like them?

Not sure what "average" salary means but nowadays $500 (USD) is a good salary in Argentina. Most people make a lot less. I'm waiting to see how the "caste" are going to be affected. I suggest Milei issue a decree reducing Congressional salaries by 50%. They could still live very well on that.

 

[antipodean]

Contrary to the hate espoused online, these people aren't "parasites" as Mileistas would have you believe. My SIL is a domestic worker, and cleans the houses of middle class and wealthy Argentines. With the new year "raises" domestic workers earn $1.50/hr. She works 6 days a week while raising her son, taking him to school, and ensuring he is kept busy after class so he doesn't go down a bad path in life. She is the one paying for the adjustment, not the members of this forum or the people who make up Milei's cabinet.

Out of interest:
- who did she and those in her household vote for?
- how much meat were she and those in her household able to purchase in the last three years with wages of less than $1.50 an hour (or less than $288 a month)?

I think you will find that many Mileistas (eg those that actually voted for the guy) are those with the least to left to loose, and those paying more for the adjustment are those who unfairly enjoyed a higher standard of living than her thanks to subsidies on almost everything they consumed, which if you were earning and consuming $300-$500 worth of subsidized goods and services each month meant you were receiving more subsidies than someone earning and consuming $288 a month but working just as hard, no?

 

[QuilmesSlo]

This is what I find frustrating about the Mileistas here, elsewhere online, and in real life. It's easy to be pro adjustment when you either have dollars or a wealthy family, but for the people on the margins of society it was bad with Alberto and it's still getting worse.

Where has the caste been hit exactly? Last I could tell they're doing fine and it's the working poor that have seen their incomes and livelihoods (as much as they had any to begin with) subject to lingchi.

People here like to talk about Argentine friends and them generally being okay and supportive of the agenda, but I'm willing to guess these friends come from a very different class than people like my in laws who live in Zona Sur, one rung above a "barrio popular".

Contrary to the hate espoused online, these people aren't "parasites" as Mileistas would have you believe. My SIL is a domestic worker, and cleans the houses of middle class and wealthy Argentines. With the new year "raises" domestic workers earn $1.50/hr. She works 6 days a week while raising her son, taking him to school, and ensuring he is kept busy after class so he doesn't go down a bad path in life. She is the one paying for the adjustment, not the members of this forum or the people who make up Milei's cabinet.

I'm not saying those of us (at least not most of us) on the forum are bad people, but I see so many folks talk about these things in the abstract. The average salary in Argentina was $500 a month according to an article Rich One posted last week, and millions more earn less than this, even when working full time and getting pitiful planes. These people suffered under Alberto, nobody is denying that, but they're suffering even worse now under Milei.

As Mikic said, what good is the chemo if we're just killing the patient? This is what I fear, that the adjustment never comes for us beyond dollar inflation and it's the millions like my SIL who just languish in poverty. She has my husband and I, but is too proud or embarrassed to ask or accept help and feels she shouldn't have to when she works for a living and always has. What do the rest of people do whose family are suffering just like them?

Let me just provide some personal context, because you are suggesting a level of callousness from what I wrote.

I don't have blood family here, and I am not a citizen. I am guest. Accordingly, these political choices are for the Argentine people to make, from my perspective.

For you it's appropriately more personal.

If Milei's reforms work, and your nephew has a shot at a better future, I think your sister in law will look back on the painful transition as a necessary step for the country. There is another scenario in which his reforms don't work -- too much pain, too little relief, and a swing back to Peronist policies. Pain for no gain would be a total failure, for sure.

I wish the best for your family, and for the entire country.

 

[mikic007]

Let me just provide some personal context, because you are suggesting a level of callousness from what I wrote.

I don't have blood family here, and I am not a citizen. I am guest. Accordingly, these political choices are for the Argentine people to make, from my perspective.

For you it's appropriately more personal.

If Milei's reforms work, and your nephew has a shot at a better future, I think your sister in law will look back on the painful transition as a necessary step for the country. There is another scenario in which his reforms don't work -- too much pain, too little relief, and a swing back to Peronist policies. Pain for no gain would be a total failure, for sure.

I wish the best for your family, and for the entire country.

That's the problem, it doesn't have to be too painful for the ones already on the edge. It's already painful, more is over the edge and no future for no son.

That the country poorly manages subsidies is no guilt of the poor. That I get electricity bill of few dolars, while spending equivalent of at least 70 in my country is travesty. I didn't ask for subsidy, don't know even how to avoid it and if normal pricing even exists. Similar for a lot of services. If those subsidies would go only to the poor, we couldn't even speak of the number, cost benefit would be positive.

Normal country establish measures and targets subsidies. Argentina is terribly lacking in this regard and I expect from financial gurus to fix that, not to go the easiest way and just quit altogether. I mean, some effort is visible, but to built such system is far beyond of those meager efforts.

 

[QuilmesSlo]

That's the problem, it doesn't have to be too painful for the ones already on the edge. It's already painful, more is over the edge and no future for no son.

That the country poorly manages subsidies is no guilt of the poor. That I get electricity bill of few dolars, while spending equivalent of at least 70 in my country is travesty. I didn't ask for subsidy, don't know even how to avoid it and if normal pricing even exists. Similar for a lot of services. If those subsidies would go only to the poor, we couldn't even speak of the number, cost benefit would be positive.

Normal country establish measures and targets subsidies. Argentina is terribly lacking in this regard and I expect from financial gurus to fix that, not to go the easiest way and just quit altogether. I mean, some effort is visible, but to built such system is far beyond of those meager efforts.

Of course what you say makes sense.

I would only say, you are expecting the Argentine political system to steer like a Porsche. It does not and never has. It's like an old International Harvester farm truck, where you are swinging that big old wheel back and forth just to stay straight on the road. Milei does not not have a scalpel; he's got a chain saw.

 

[Jtee125]

I’ve been away for 3 weeks. From a quick glance inflation seems to have been bad in December but the WU rate seems the same as it was when I left. Interested to see what’s changed when I return in a few days

 

[wrangler]

My friend and I recently ordered premium meat from a vendor known for its quality. The meat, certified by various authorities including those in the USA, is organic and sourced from a trusted 'pastoril' supplier. We chose Lomo, and our latest shipment has just arrived. We're splitting 8.7 kilos at a cost of 200,000 pesos. That's 4.35 kilos each, amounting to 100,000 pesos each. I think the price will be close to double that next time we order.

 

[Quilombo]

Not sure what "average" salary means but nowadays $500 (USD) is a good salary in Argentina. Most people make a lot less. I'm waiting to see how the "caste" are going to be affected. I suggest Milei issue a decree reducing Congressional salaries by 50%. They could still live very well on that.

Average being the average of formal the formally employed en blanco. It's not a great salary in CABA, but it's not terrible either, sure beats minimum wage. I would be 100% in favor of him reducing Congress' dietas, but again, that's the caste, and running against them vs. actually doing something are two different things.

Let me just provide some personal context, because you are suggesting a level of callousness from what I wrote.

I don't have blood family here, and I am not a citizen. I am guest. Accordingly, these political choices are for the Argentine people to make, from my perspective.

For you it's appropriately more personal.

If Milei's reforms work, and your nephew has a shot at a better future, I think your sister in law will look back on the painful transition as a necessary step for the country. There is another scenario in which his reforms don't work -- too much pain, too little relief, and a swing back to Peronist policies. Pain for no gain would be a total failure, for sure.

I wish the best for your family, and for the entire country.

I wasn't addressing it to anyone specifically, just commenting on a sentiment I've noticed amongst people broadly (the trolls and sadists I ignore using the forum's feature). I think most of us here want what's best for Argentines, we just disagree how to achieve that. Everyday I hope that I am wrong about Milei, but every day (mind you it's not quite been a month yet) I feel like my suspicion is increasingly confirmed, that the adjustment comes for those who have the least, not for the caste.

Milei's still got 3 years and 11 months to prove his critics wrong and I earnestly hope he does.

That's the problem, it doesn't have to be too painful for the ones already on the edge. It's already painful, more is over the edge and no future for no son.

That the country poorly manages subsidies is no guilt of the poor. That I get electricity bill of few dolars, while spending equivalent of at least 70 in my country is travesty. I didn't ask for subsidy, don't know even how to avoid it and if normal pricing even exists. Similar for a lot of services. If those subsidies would go only to the poor, we couldn't even speak of the number, cost benefit would be positive.

Normal country establish measures and targets subsidies. Argentina is terribly lacking in this regard and I expect from financial gurus to fix that, not to go the easiest way and just quit altogether. I mean, some effort is visible, but to built such system is far beyond of those meager efforts.

I have mixed feelings about meanstesting. In developed countries there are numerous examples of times at which meanstesting or crack downs on abuse of social programs actually hurt the very people that needed the help (Robodebt in Australia, kinderopvangtoeslagaffaire in the Netherlands, Medicaid Estate Recovery in the US, etc.) Do we trust the government here would do a better job? That being said, I would support a reform to subsidies and investigation of graft.

Potenciar Trabajo had a couple thousand formal government employees receiving the benefit for example, and people who get electricity subsidies are banned from accessing the dolar ahorro which only makes sense, if you're rich enough to buy dollars for saving you probably don't need help paying your power bill. At the same time, some people have been banned from buying the MEP dollar because in 2020 they worked at a business that received financial aid from the government, a choice for which they had no control over, so this is why I have mixed feelings.

I suppose for now some of the easiest reforms to implement would be creating a social plan/subsidy blacklist of people who buy MEP/CCL dollars, or pay ganacias, or travel abroad by airplane, or whose SIM card is connected to an iPhone 15 etc. because they obviously don't need the help of the state.

I personally choose to not to receive the subsidies even though I qualify for them because I'd rather they go to the people who actually need the help, but I get why a lot of Argentines feel entitled to them even if they don't/shouldn't qualify because they see stuff like the Potencia Trabajo fraud or the Caso Chocolate with dozens of debit cards scamming the PBA and figure "hey, everyone else is scamming, why shouldn't I".

There's a lot of change needed in the country and I just don't want it to fall on the people who can least handle it that's my main concern