CFK, Inc. Wants Foreigners and 16-Year-Olds to Vote

[TheBlackHand]

Since voting is mandatory in Argentina, I would think that everyone eligible to vote will also be required to vote.

This is what worries me most. Will permanent residents be REQUIRED to vote?

 

[TheBlackHand]

I guess I just don't believe that the 3 million people who might now be eligible to vote are all mindless drones. And as to whether they are " professionals " or not is irrelevant as far as who should be allowed to vote or not.

And as far as allowing 16 year old's to vote, Brazil does the same thing as does Austria and I don't think their elections have been adversely affected by it. But like I said, who knows, only time will tell.

Allowing more people to vote when it is an informed vote is a great thing.

Allowing more to vote when it is a bought/manipulated vote is terrible.

This is increasing the voting population by 10%, 1million perm residents and 2 million minors -- do you really think that 16-18 year olds are very informed? Most certainly are not. Very few 18-25 year olds are informed.

Furthermore most of this 10% are from umm, shall we say non-professional workers -- in effect taking away more power from the rapidly shrinking middle class in Argentina.

 

[sergio]

Why sixteen? Why not ten?

 

[JugoMoyano]

Very few 18-25 year olds are informed.

Look at the U.S., and it is clear that the majority of the population is misinformed. What's your point? Should governments make everyone take a test before voting?

 

[ElQueso]

People who question those who question the "informed-ness" of the population of immigrants from MERCOSUR countries may not actually know anyone from this group. I'm not saying have met and talked to - I mean know. Know them and their backgrounds, where they came from and what they're doing here. You don't begin to get a feeling for the absolute lack of understanding in most of them until you talk to them in depth, get an understanding of how they actually think, what's important to them and what they know - and why they know it.

Now, that's my direct, personal experience. Others' may vary I'm going by what I've seen and not hearsay or the desire that I really have to want everyone to be equal. From birth I truly believe we are all equal, within variances of capabilities, but it's what our parents and societies do to us as children that create inequalities that really matter.

I know there are many immigrants from MERCORSUR countries who don't follow the depth of ignorance that I'm talking about. However, their societies are full of many thoughts about the wonderful benefits of a government run to take care of the people (even though they've never experienced it - they're searching for El Dorado). The well-educated in those countries who come here will have a bent toward the kind of politics here due to the way they grew up, maybe, but more will probably be freer thinkers. Shop keepers who have run businesses and had a basic education - maybe split.

But I think most of the people who immigrate to Argentina from other countries in the region are the poor and ignorant of their respective countries, looking for the city paved with gold. I've been to really poor places in Paraguay where people think almost literally of Buenos Aires like that. They think that someone comes here, finds a job immediately and starts becoming rich, because the paltry $50 USD value of what they send home a month is a lot of money back there and the people back there see the results, not what it took to get it.

But many times, once they come here, they don't want to go back. I know people who have lived in the villa near me for 5 years, came from Paraguay, and don't want to go back. Even living there is better than life in Paraguay for the really poor, in some eyes. Why would they want to screw up what they see is a good thing? They don't see very far in the future and are not thinking about climbing the corporate ladder and retiring. Hell, they'll have kids who will take care of their retirement.

I don't want to get into a discussion, personally, about who should vote and who shouldn't - as far as citizens go. One thing I don't mind saying, I don't believe that people who are ineligible for military, going to jail, or even to drink, are necessarily ready to vote. As far as permanent residents go - I can understand the sentiment, but permanent residents don't have a stake in the country. Particularly as to how relatively easy it is to get citizenship here. If they want to vote, they should put their roots down.

Hell, I have permanent residency, but I have no business voting here. I am thinking seriously about leaving Argentina. What sense does it make for me to be deciding anything about this country? It's obvious I haven't made my mind up to be a citizen - I haven't done what's needed to become one (and don't intend to).

It's the same thing with those uncounted millions who are immigrants from the region and are permanent residents (or even here without a regularized status). If you want to have a say in the running of the country, become a citizen.

Meanwhile, this is a play for the Kirchneristas to get a stronghold on the voting in this country, a coup de grace for the shaky democracy that currently exists.

 

[ElQueso]

Look at the U.S., and it is clear that the majority of the population is misinformed. What's your point? Should governments make everyone take a test before voting?

Yeah, everywhere has that kind of problem. There are very few places in the world, except perhaps for some small (a few million or more people), successful countries where many more are better informed than other countries.

The depth of ignorance between ignorant poor here and ignorant poor in the US is about like the difference between the living conditions between the two groups - most people in the US have no idea what real poverty is, nor what real ignorance is.

It would be like making all the illegals in the US citizens overnight giving them the power to vote. Is that right? Tough subject. Even if it is, is that the way to go about it? It would give the Democrats an immediate boost in voters. I don't remember the numbers, but I believe that what they are talking about doing here would have a greater impact for the Peronists than it would for the Democrats in the US were they to give citizenship to every illegal resident.

Again - why make permanent residents, who are not citizens and don't necessarily have a permanent stake in the country, eligible to vote?

There's only one reason that makes sense.

 

[scotttswan]

My permanent resident DNI booklet already came with voting pages...

Are they not wanting to do away with voting pages and just use cards?

 

[Frinkiac7]

An utter disaster. As if they weren't already making a mockery out of the country.

 

[solerboy]

Again - why make permanent residents, who are not citizens and don't necessarily have a permanent stake in the country, eligible to vote?

Never heard the phrase "No taxation without representation" ?

 

[syngirl]

Look at the U.S., and it is clear that the majority of the population is misinformed. What's your point? Should governments make everyone take a test before voting?

No that's not at all what I'm saying.

Argentina is a country where voting is REQUIRED. It's not like many other countries where voting is optional.

When it's something that is required and you're uninformed about candidates, where's your vote -- your vote that you have no choice but to make -- going to go? I'm willing to bet 9 times out of 10 it will go to whatever party is in power because odds are that's the only name on the list you're going to recognise.

This is a powerful tool not just for CFK but for any future govt in Argentina. They say it is for greater democracy, I highly doubt that is their true motivation.