Do fears of crime in Argentina reflect reality?

[ReemsterCARP]

Joe, it's easy to focus on that part of my post. If you read the whole post it's more nuanced and you'd realize that i was talking about barrio norte, not BsAs in general.

 

[fedecc]

Blumberg son got killed after a ransom was paid, but actually he was just a crybaby not? Just like the 200.000 plus who attended a rally to demand more security and they did go there on the free will and not for a soda, hotdog and free transport ?

Indeed, Blumberg disappeared from the public scene, not because of the mothers, but because he lied regarding him being an "ingeniero" or something like that. He burned what was left of his credibility.

Was it the same madre who was cheering after 2900 innocent people lost there life on 911?

It always amuses me when a tourist takes a picture of him/her self with the mothers ignoring what they actually stand for. And not to mention Bonafini's hate speech.

 

[Joe]

Joe, it's easy to focus on that part of my post. If you read the whole post it's more nuanced and you'd realize that i was talking about barrio norte, not BsAs in general.

The underlying theme I've noticed from some of these posts is that Americans and Europeans come down here and condescend towards Argentinians who are justifiably concerned with security: "Oh the locals just watch the trumped up media reports and form vigilante groups because they are unable to understand the 'nuances' of the issue"

The last thing Argentina needs to import from America is its wacky notions of political correctness.

 

[HDM]

Um. I don't see the condescension here, although it is pretty rampant other places on this site. I think the non-Argentine folks here (the expats as in the blog title) are expressing opinions that reflect their particular, personal experiences. At least that's what I was doing. I have had no experiences whatsoever with crime here. If I said otherwise, I would have to make it up. I have lived in worse cities (in terms of crime, although not in terms of cuisine), where crime was quite universalized. I don't understand enough Spanish anyway to have much of an idea how the locals react. I'll have to take your word for it.

Returning to the question heading the thread, I suppose the answer depends on whose reality.

 

[BlahBlah]

Indeed, Blumberg disappeared from the public scene, not because of the mothers, but because he lied regarding him being an "ingeniero" or something like that. He burned what was left of his credibility.

He probally shouldnt have gone Political as his fight was never political in the first place. He is however the only one who could fill plaza de mayo in the democratic era with people on there free will. A case can be made for the FAA but that happend after Blumberg.

His fake diploma has got to do with it offcourse, but he was the one who was using it. Campaings lik that of the goverment( Franscisco-Efidrina, Mauricio - Franco, Carrio not living within her means) sometimes work, especially in the south and east of the Conurbano

 

[Recoleta Carolina]

Of course we all speak from our own experience, a survey of one. Then too, 100 surveys of one become a real survey, small, but with a voice. I am tall, blue eyed, in my opinion easily identifiable as a foreigner. I am female and often am on the streets alone, though only in daylight. The caveats of my answer begin with that. I don't go out much at night, take taxis when I do and am usually with my boyfriend at night. We don't drink heavily when we are out, we don't carry large amounts of cash, we don't over dress (much) and we've never had a problem. Even those nights we have gone out, San Telmo, Palermo, Recoleta, Barrio Norte, Flores, Belgrano and other barrios have been quiet and peaceful for the most part even at 2 or 3 in the morning. Twice (that I know of) someone has tried to steal from my bag on the subte but because I keep my valuables on an inside pocket they never got anything but a feel of my tissue packet. I also don't know anyone whose been robbed and have never met anyone first hand whose had violence done on them. For my money it's a fairly safe city if you are cautious and responsible. If it matters, we live in Congreso and don't own a car. Our building has 24 hour doormen. We feel very safe.

I live very much like you. I do not go out much at night and NEVER by myself. I do not drink much alcohol if I do go out so that I always am aware of my surroundings. I do not carry much money with me EVER. I always take taxis.

These are all good precautions but they indicate that on some level we know that we are not living in a safe place. I have witnessed a few motor scooter robberies in the best areas of Recoleta in mid daylight. Normal looking people. Not tourists. Just out walking. Once you see it a few times you start believing that there is a crime problem.

 

[Recoleta Carolina]

Well ... what is your opinion? This is just a pasted article.

Here's my opinion, but first the caveat. I have lived here six months. I live in a rich neighborhood, although not everyone in this area is all that rich. I live in a regular neighborhood, no walls or gated communities, just a regular part of the city with people going about their business and their lives. I am sure I have a viewpoint distorted by where I am, who I am, and what I know. I do not live in a villa miseria ... but does anyone reading this live in such a barrio?

On the other hand, what I just wrote makes me a juicy target. Or it ought to. I think I stick out as a rich person. Not once in these six months have I felt threatened or worried about the situation I found myself in. Although it must be said that I certainly do not go about looking for danger ... the looking for Mr. Goodbar effect.

I find, in my personal experience, Buenos Aires to be an amazingly safe city for one this size and on this continent. I live been in truly dangerous cities: Rio, Jo-burg, and Mexico City, to name three. I have felt more overt threats in NYC than I have here.

This is not to diminish the reality of crime, which I have no doubt exists in spades. And for some Portenos, it must be a daily, even an hourly, element of life. But there ought to be some perspective. There are cities in the world of comparable size that are so much more overtly dangerous than BAires that it is difficult to make a fair comparison.

So, cutting to the chase, one's perception of the reality of crime in Buenos Aires must depend on who you are, where you live, and what you choices are. My perspective is, Buenos Aires is better than most world cities of comparable size, but it's not Topeka.

Are you the person who posted around a month ago that you keep your wallet close to your genitals? People who feel safe definitely do not even think to do this.

You have stated that you have limited use of Spanish. That will take you a long way to not having a complete understanding of the place where you live. Not even a close understanding. Not being able to watch the local news or read the local newspaper goes a long way to keeping people ignorant of the rapidly growing crime rate in Buenos Aires.

Nobody remembers the local rally against the rise of crime this past March in Buenos Aires? Where do you guys live? Or, is it that you just spend all day long on the internet so you "tune out" in that way.

Actually, most of the expats that I know that live in BA spend most of their life hiding in their apartments and living on their computers. It does not speak well for enjoying the city and all that it has to offer.

 

[tangobob]

Actually, most of the expats that I know that live in BA spend most of their life hiding in their apartments and living on their computers. It does not speak well for enjoying the city and all that it has to offer.

You must know the wealthier expats. I rarely take taxis as I am always living to budget. But I do go out every night when I am in town, and regularly walk the streets (take the bus) in the early hours. Of course I take precautions, like carrying very little money and not standing out. I have walked along the streets of Mataderos, Balvenera, Villa Urquiza, Villa crespo, I think you get the point, all the rough areas where tango is at its best, and as yet have never been acosted.
Bear in mind I come from a very rough area, where I would not dream of walking late at night, so of course I have learned how to be inconspicuous and protect myself. I believe crime has increased, but then it has increased every where, this is still a relatively safe city.

 

[BlahBlah]

I live very much like you. I do not go out much at night and NEVER by myself. I do not drink much alcohol if I do go out so that I always am aware of my surroundings. I do not carry much money with me EVER. I always take taxis.

These are all good precautions but they indicate that on some level we know that we are not living in a safe place. I have witnessed a few motor scooter robberies in the best areas of Recoleta in mid daylight. Normal looking people. Not tourists. Just out walking. Once you see it a few times you start believing that there is a crime problem.

I go out at night, dont take taxi's, drink at night but never so much that I dont know how to come back, use public transport, dont wear jewelery, have a cheap cell phone and only go to Microcentro, Recoleta, Puerto Madero, Belgrano, Nunez, Palermo, Zona Norte and San Telmo but that is because I don't care about the other parts of town and speak perfect Spanish

I don't know why they would rob me, and if they do they can have my 70 peso I have with me and my 150 peso phone, I can miss it

 

[BlahBlah]

If I however don't speak the language, don't understand the culture, walk around with a full wallet, credit cards, drive around in fancy car, use my blackberry, wear my goldwatch, talk about how succesfull I are in bars and go to mataderos or La Matanza I probally wouldn't last 2 months