"Insecurity is just a perception"

[sergio]

I have a feeling that most of the expats who post that BA is no worse than many cities in the US (I've read this over and over in numerous threads here) have never actually LIVED in an American city. I suspect that most lived in middle class suburbs but not actually in real urban areas. For many BA is their first experience with a big city. They go on and on about how dangerous New York and other cities are but I have to disagree. Having lived in big US cities including New York I have to say that BA is now much more dangerous. Don't tell me about crime in Harlem, the Bronx, etc. Compare Recoleta with equivalent parts of Manhattan. It is much riskier in BA. I've seen the crime explode in BA. It is a reality. What really unnerves me is that almost everyone I know has been a victim of crime. I just CAN NOT say the same about my friends in the US.

 

[Gringoboy]

My point being that it's convenient for the Gov to keep them there like other poor people and dupe them.
They will always be used for political purposes. Just watch the next election.

 

[SaraSara]

I have a feeling that most of the expats who post that BA is no worse than many cities in the US (I've read this over and over in numerous threads here) have never actually LIVED in an American city. I suspect that most lived in middle class suburbs but not actually in real urban areas. For many BA is their first experience with a big city. They go on and on about how dangerous New York and other cities are but I have to disagree. Having lived in big US cities including New York I have to say that BA is now much more dangerous. Don't tell me about crime in Harlem, the Bronx, etc. Compare Recoleta with equivalent parts of Manhattan. It is much riskier in BA. I've seen the crime explode in BA. It is a reality. What really unnerves me is that almost everyone I know has been a victim of crime. I just CAN NOT say the same about my friends in the US.

I lived in downtown Washington, DC for nine years, in an area comparable to Palermo. The house had no bars, no alarm system, and no security. We could leave the bicycles in the front porch in plain view of passersby, and nothing was ever taken. We could walk the dog at all hours of the night and park the car in the street without fear. We left the house vacant for months at a time when we came to BA, and found everything all right when we returned.

NOT A SINGLE ONE of our friends or acquaintances in Washington was ever held up, neither were their houses robbed. Here, I don't know anyone who hasn't been robbed at least once. That includes myself (two US$ 1,300 spare tires stolen), and my daughter (purse lifted from a Las Cañitas restaurant with her iPod, cell phone, and camera - about nine hundred dollars worth of stuff at US prices).

I'm in my sixties, and have never seen anything comparable to what's going on in BA right now, yet the government avoids the issue and pretends this is just a "sensation" . That is adding insult to injury.

 

[darmanad]

Maybe it's because the very inhabitants of these villas are human beings and don't deserve to be just cleared.

Tangobob,
Well, I'm a human being, so are you, and so is everyone else including the victims of crime and those whose quality of life is diminshed because they feel insecure in their homes and on the street. Are you advocating that govt should never fix problems if the fix would cause inconvenience or even great hardship to someone or some group?
I am not knowledgeable about villa demographics, but I thought many of the homes/dwellings are illegal for one reason or another, e.g., no construction permit, no compliance with building codes or zoning ordinances, no meters for payment of municipal services, failure to pay taxes like ABL, no rightful ownership/deeds other than perhaps those founded on squatters' rights. Additionally, I wonder what % of the inhabitants are in AR illegally and are working illlegally without paying taxes? What % are engaged in criminal activity?

A person who violates the law to satisfy his own agenda (even a compelling one), has no right to continue doing so just because compliance with the law would work a hardship. Nor should any such person have a reasonable expectation that he should be able to violate the law indefinitely. It should come as no surprise to a lawbreaker that the law may intervene to stop the violation.

Occupants of villas that are in violation of the law may not deserve to be mistreated, but it is equally true that they do not deserve to be permitted to continue to live in illegal dwellings, especially if these villas contribute significantly to crime, a propositon that seems pretty clear.

Villa 31 and the villa by the ecological reserve occupy what would ordinarily be pretty expensive land (because of their proximity to upscale neighborhoods). Why would it be wrong for the city to renovate these areas? Those villa residents that were legal residents and that had legal title to land (and buildings thereon) would be compensated the fair market value of the property. They would also be entitled to own and/or rent partially subsidized public housing in the suburbs, public housing that could be financed with the profits from the sale of the villa land to developers as well as the enormously increased tax base of the new housing built on the sites.

 

[JHB1216]

It seems to me that there are WAY more guns in the US. Hence, I'm a bit more afraid in the US than in Argentina.

My Argentine friend states that there are fewer guns in Argentina. Only the criminals have them. Does that make everyone less afraid?

 

[AkBill]

What is this villa at the entrance of the ecological reserve?? which entrance exactly? I go jogging there everyday and never saw anything, but I tend to have my mp3 blasting and my head down and enter my own little world

 

[darmanad]

What is this villa at the entrance of the ecological reserve?? which entrance exactly? I go jogging there everyday and never saw anything, but I tend to have my mp3 blasting and my head down and enter my own little world

The entrance to the villa ( it may be called "rodrigo") is just a couple 100 meters past the entrance

 

[SaraSara]

I take the Autopista Illia regularly - it's the one that goes right by the Villa 31. Interestingly enough, most homes have a DIRECT TV dish mounted on the roof.

 

[AkBill]

Now I see, villa Rodrigo Bueno "una de las villas más peligrosas de la ciudad." Scarey as I got lost on that side of the eco reserve a while ago (i'm one of these people who can get lost anywhere..) and was wandering around aimlessly for a while.

Also read that they were offered 15 000 pesos each to leave and refused. Since the police and authorities refuse to enter why wouldn't they just take the 15 000 and go on holiday for a month then move back in?

 

[Bajo_cero2]

Tangobob,
Well, I'm a human being, so are you, and so is everyone else including the victims of crime and those whose quality of life is diminshed because they feel insecure in their homes and on the street.

People with paranoia should take psychiatric medication.

Are you advocating that govt should never fix problems if the fix would cause inconvenience or even great hardship to someone or some group?

Well, there was a mayor like 30 years ago, you probably love him, he used a bulldozer and destroyed all the villas.

What is the inconvenience? You don´t like to see indigence?

I am not knowledgeable about villa demographics, but I thought many of the homes/dwellings are illegal for one reason or another, e.g., no construction permit, no compliance with building codes or zoning ordinances, no meters for payment of municipal services, failure to pay taxes like ABL, no rightful ownership/deeds other than perhaps those founded on squatters' rights.

This is probably 50% true, but in a civilized country like this one, the state is responsible for provide proper houses. If you go out a little around, you will see they are building new neighborhoods. Take a look at Av. Gral Paz and Richieri, there used to be Villas at 3 of the 4 corners, there are almost no villas today.

Additionally, I wonder what % of the inhabitants are in AR illegally and are working illlegally without paying taxes?

In fact, they are all legals as mercosur citizens. What about you?

Taxes, let´s see. In this country if a worker is working under the table (en negro), this is 100% legal for the worker and 100% illegal for the employer.

People has rights because they are humans in this country.

What % are engaged in criminal activity?

In fact, criminality in Buenos Aires State is regarding to the police. Just take a look at the kidnapping cases. The brain is always a cop.

A person who violates the law to satisfy his own agenda (even a compelling one), has no right to continue doing so just because compliance with the law would work a hardship.

What do you suggest, that poor people commit suicide???
In fact, if the law doesn´t allow you to live, what is illegal is the law.
Housing, working, inocence are rights protected by the argentinian bill of rights.

Nor should any such person have a reasonable expectation that he should be able to violate the law indefinitely. It should come as no surprise to a lawbreaker that the law may intervene to stop the violation.

What about you? Should DGM deport you?

Occupants of villas that are in violation of the law may not deserve to be mistreated, but it is equally true that they do not deserve to be permitted to continue to live in illegal dwellings, especially if these villas contribute significantly to crime, a propositon that seems pretty clear.

Seems you don´t know the law. For the last 3000 years to ocupy land give you right over it after some time. The people who live at the villas cannot be just kick out because they own the land and the houses. It is call usucapion.

Villa 31 and the villa by the ecological reserve occupy what would ordinarily be pretty expensive land (because of their proximity to upscale neighborhoods). Why would it be wrong for the city to renovate these areas? Those villa residents that were legal residents and that had legal title to land (and buildings thereon) would be compensated the fair market value of the property. They would also be entitled to own and/or rent partially subsidized public housing in the suburbs, public housing that could be financed with the profits from the sale of the villa land to developers as well as the enormously increased tax base of the new housing built on the sites.

Guess what? These villas are in public land, it cannot be selled. Bad luck.
Regards