Kiwi raised, London bred and looking for work in Buenos Aires!

[YanquiGallego]

I agree wholeheartedly that itd be wise to do some reading up on posts about people "divorcing" BA, like I did about a month ago. I think that people who are romanced with the idea of coming to BA, are like people who had a high school sweetheart or a crush on someone, went out on a date and got to know them again after years of not having seen them, and then see that its not the same person they loved. Sadly, this is what happened to me with BA. The days of "The Paris of South America" are long gone and it is looking more and like Argenzuela and Bolivia than anything else, and its only going to get worst.

 

[YanquiGallego]

A variety of some food and good delivery you will always get, as Argies are used to conveniences, having everything brought to their homes, and " cheto" food items like Starbucks at Alto Palermo or Benihana, you will just pay more for it than you would in the States.

 

[ElQueso]

I think it really depends on what people are used to as far as meat goes. I'm not impressed with the way most parillas in the city cook their meat - hurried and often not a very good cut of meat. Not very consistent, often. Even the best places have provided me with a tough piece of over-cooked meat. But then, I'm from Texas where I've always cooked even my steaks slowly over a mesquite or hickory wood fire. Or briskets cooked for 6-7 hours over an apple wood fire. Smoked, not grilled.

I have a few friends, one in particular from Florida, where (according to him) they love to use gas grills (not that there are not a few infidels in Texas who do the same ). but he and others who may (or may not) cook on gas grills seem to like the parillas here (how the meat is cooked) more than I do. Don't get me wrong - I'm pure carnivore and make do just fine with the parillas. But I'm more partial to matambrito de cerdo when I go to a parilla because it is better made for a grill and how meat is cooked here than a lomo, for example (in many cases, not all).

Japanese food is becoming somewhat of a fashion here, so it's getting better. There are some decent Peruvian places, a good Colombian place I know. A half-way decent Indian place. Chinese - nothing at all what I'm used to in terms of quality, but one place in particular that has a halfway decent Kung Pao (they will even spice it up more than the normal Argentine palate can stand if you ask) and some other things.

It's not that international foods are not available - they are largely (in my opinion, and many others) few and far between, expensive, and not always consistent. And sure, they are not what I'm used to in the States.

I lived in Houston, where there is a high concentration of restaurants per square mile. It didn't even show up in the rankings when I did a search on restaurants per square mile in the US (meaning that there are obviously even better places in the States for restaurants), but in the last twenty years it grew significantly in terms of good eating places.

I could leave my house in my car and have a number of high-quality selections for anything from French, Brasilian, Chinese, Japanese, Thai, Mexican, Cajun, American home-cooked, Vietnamese, Texas barbeque, out of this world pizza (I can think of three different places [not big chains]) and a whole slew of different fast-food places (i.e., more than just McDonalds and Burger king - Although Wendy's has made a reappearance here and their spicy chicken sandwich is almost as spicy as what's available in the States) available within 5 minutes' driving time. Many even closer.

All the foods I've listed above were brought from my memory from places I used to frequent.

So to people who are used to that sort of availability, BA doesn't come close.

For people who didn't have such diversity where they are from, things seem pretty good here, I reckon. And then there is the plain old difference in taste that one can't account for with anything more than personal opinion - to each their own.

As far as depending on bringing electronics from home - hope you can lug everything you'll need, and that what you bring down doesn't break or need to be replaced. Living here short term, that works fine. Otherwise, not so much. Same with clothes, furniture, electrodomestics, etc.

I didn't get tired of Argentine food for almost two years once I came here. My clothes lasted me a bit more than that. I bought most of my first set of kitchen stuff and furniture from an acquaintance who sublet his long term lease to me, and his wife was a trained chef, so I lucked out there (with the kitchen stuff).

When that stuff started wearing out or breaking (as happens) I found that it is very hard to find decent replacements for a lot of the stuff because it simply isn't available.

I guess what I'm getting at here, is that not only does it depend on the tastes of different people, I think it also depends on whether you are here for a year or two to "learn Spanish and the culture" or if you have come here to live.

 

[snowwhitebum]

Its like this -

If you want first class shopping experiences, good choice of mid range restaurants and cheap mobile telephones BA is not for you, however, if you like the idea of not being surrounded by Louis Vuitton'd Starbucks toting i-clones, decent high end restaurants, cheap cigarettes, friendly enough people, good choice of bars and clubs, good looking people (not all), cheap rents, cheap taxis, choice of theaters (albeit seasonal), I could go on but I am sure you get the point, I think you will find BA just fine.

I would not take as gospel anything read on here as a lot of posters seem to be disillusioned with the place for their inability to purchase some product or other from their home country or the unfriendly nature of the locals. The fact is it is what you make it.

A traveler came upon an old farmer hoeing in his field beside the road. Eager to rest his feet, the wanderer hailed the countryman, who seemed happy enough to straighten his back and talk for a moment.
"What sort of people live in the next town?" asked the stranger.

"What were the people like where you've come from?" replied the farmer, answering the question with another question.

"They were a bad lot. Troublemakers all, and lazy too. The most selfish people in the world, and not a one of them to be trusted. I'm happy to be leaving the scoundrels."

"Is that so?" replied the old farmer. "Well, I'm afraid that you'll find the same sort in the next town.

Disappointed, the traveler trudged on his way, and the farmer returned to his work.

Some time later another stranger, coming from the same direction, hailed the farmer, and they stopped to talk. "What sort of people live in the next town?" he asked.

"What were the people like where you've come from?" replied the farmer once again.

"They were the best people in the world. Hard working, honest, and friendly. I'm sorry to be leaving them."

"Fear not," said the farmer. "You'll find the same sort in the next town."

 

[ElQueso]

The fact is - we've all, who've been on this forum for quite some time, who have lived here and tried to make a life here (as opposed to coming down to have fun, with the future as a side issue), have seen a number of people become quite disillusioned with Argentina after living here for awhile (usually more than a year, when the possibilities of laying down some kind of roots, no matter if not completely long term, start to solidify. In some cases it takes longer, some shorter). We've watched a number of people go from how perfect this place is, how can you just criticize all the time, to yeah, jeez, is this for me? Myself included.

It's not because we can't get the things we're used to. It's not because ALL of the locals are meanies (they're not). It's not because we're homesick.

All of those play into it, sure. Nothing in this world is black and white. It's certainly not black and white that everyone who comes here will hate it or love it here.

I have watched over the the last 6 year, those who come here, maybe have been here before for a couple of months, not having had to deal with the long-term fickleness of their new lover yet. Feeling great about the place and spreading that feeling to others (which I am NOT scorning or criticizing), scorning advice from those who have lived here (yeah, I'm criticizing the criticism of the criticism ), as if it's not possible that this fresh-skinned young siren could have any defects worth mentioning. Deriding instead, those who have been jilted by her as used up and worn out husks, bitter because obviously they did not prove to be worthy of the love the city has to give.

But that's OK - new blood is needed to keep the old, poor hag looking young, the magic needed to keep up her veneer of beauty to attract new people to her lair.

As I've said (and others, I know, have said as well), if you are here for a short time, come and party. Definitely try it out. Just be aware of the siren's song - it's painfully hard to ignore, I know. But it's a lot easier to break away from than it was for Odysseus and his men.

If you're planning to move here and make a life here - listen to what the "old-timers" have to say. Don't be like a teenager who is sure that he or she need not listen to the advice of old fogies in how to prepare for life, because as everyone knows, adolescents already know everything. And old fogies shouldn't make the mistake they make - the youngsters aren't completely stupid either. Nothing's absolute and everyone ends up taking their own path. (I'm using the comparison of stages of life based on time in country, not actual age. Please someone, don't accuse me of calling you a teenager for real Anyway, I'm not that old, but I have had to deal with raising 4 teenagers [not to mention having been one, as we all have], and I've lived here and gone through the stages I've seen many others go through - so I know a little something about the experience and can make what I feel to be an honest comparison).

This forum, I believe, is here for more than just telling people where the best nightclub is, where you can find stuff you like, who gives the best tours. It's also, to some extent, a mutual support network to help deal with living in a place that's not all that open and accepting over the long term without a bit of knowledge to go with it. It's certainly not easy to be comfortable unless you have a lot of money (or you have very low expectations/desires for your future) and even then, that ease is relative to other places where it doesn't take as much money to live the same lifestyle. Which requires evaluation of cost/benefit to those who would be closest to happiness in their life, I think.

Those who believe that wealth and choice and opportunity (and the irritating things, absolutely for sure, that come with it) is a bad thing - look no further, this is the perfect spot for you. You can have a much more simple life, more or less forced on you by at least availability (if not opportunity and a surging authoritarian government which may or may not last), not necessarily by choice.

The rest of us will continue evaluating it for its various facets and try to figure out what the true image is like through discussion, theorizing and data gathering and continue to make a rational decision on whether or not the pros outweigh the cons - it's a close thing for many of us.

 

[PhilinBSAS]

Hello everyone,

Kiwi raised, London bred and looking for work in Buenos Aires!

I have joined this site as one of the means of finding work. If any of you lovely people can help me or suggest anything then please get in touch. I have a lot of interests and therefore open to a wide range of work.

Brooke

Welcome Brooke ! My advice:

(1) little options for non-local professionals to find work - there is underpaid "in the black" work and expect to be cheated especially if you dont know the language/culture. Some opportunities for unpaid voluntary work which is a good way to achieve ...

(2) learn Rioplatense Spanish as quickly as possible and read up about the Portenos so you dont have to hang around the Ex-pats living in San Telmo but also ..

(3) search out some Kiwis etc or Brits or others who have been here for a while an can help you with the cultural immersion and the pitfalls - hugely different to NZ and UK and the best of the country isnt necessarily in Buenos Aires so ...!

(4) use every opportunity to find out about wonderful Argentina beyond Buenos Aires which is very varied and agricultural/spectacular but certainly not the "big city" where you can ...

(5) enjoy the BsAs buzz but do retain enough money put aside to pay for a ticket to your next destination outside Buenos Aires or Argentina but do ...

(6) take with a pinch of salt what the old fa*ts on here bang on about especially the ones who bemoan that this that and the other is nothing like the good old USA - Argentina will still be here after they have packed up and gone.

It's a great place so enjoy your time here!

 

[Bella27]

BASailor-Equal rights for women? Maybe a grander reverence for mothers than some other countries but I would not agree with EQUAL rights. They can also be an influence to their spouse behind closed doors but out in society and in the world of justice, I didn't see that it worked that way. In the work I was doing here it was very blatant that it was not necessarily the case. Women are mocked by authorities for reporting domestic abuses (after all I heard authorities say they can be emotional and enrage a man enough that he needs to take action, 'sometimes' they just need to be put in line), a rape victim assessed as worthy of a rape (disgusts me to even recall the situation), within the prison system they are not given equal access to education as the men, they are denied parental rights once sentenced and typically no longer see their children (unlike men), within a corporate world you can be asked to submit a photo of yourself before being hired, the list could go on and on especially in the Argentine corporate world. Things aren't perfect where I live but at least I can be openly respected first for my mind and a women's looks aren't at the forefront of discussions. Unlike here where I have often had comments about my looks followed up with "y sos tan inteligente".

 

[YanquiGallego]

If you want first class shopping experiences, good choice of mid range restaurants and cheap mobile telephones BA is not for you, however, if you like the idea of not being surrounded by Louis Vuitton'd Starbucks toting i-clones, decent high end restaurants, cheap cigarettes, friendly enough people, good choice of bars and clubs, good looking people (not all), cheap rents, cheap taxis, choice of theaters (albeit seasonal), I could go on but I am sure you get the point, I think you will find BA just fine.

Depending upon where you live, I would disagree with a lot of the above. Albeit not all of Argentina is Capital Federal Buenos Aires, but if you stroll down many traditional ex pat neighbourhoods like Palermo or Recoleta, the Louis Vuitton/Starbucks set is a dime a dozen, as the concheto Portenos are obsessed with their name brands and Starbucks, as are many of the yuppie "brunch in Palermo" ex pats.

I also STRONGLY disagree with the cheap rent part. We are talking about a third-world country with rent (atleast in Capital Federal) prices equivalent to that of major US cities like Chicago or Atlanta.

 

[nicoenarg]

You'll mostly find three kinds of people on this forum.

1) Those who think it blasphemous to criticize anything about Argentina. Even Argentine murderers are angelic in their opinion.
2) Those who think it blasphemous to praise anything about Argentina. Even Argentine angels are demons in disguise.
3) Those who are realists and tell you things as they are.

I'd listen to the third group and I'd say ElQueso is part of that group.

Look, its as simple as this. You don't seem to be asking whether you should come here or not. All you're saying is that you're thinking of moving to Argentina or somewhere in South America.

All I'm going to say is, be careful. Come down here with a return ticket so you don't get suffocated out of life. Its a challenging place to be but if you come here on a temporary basis rather than permanent, then you can put up with the BS that most of us have to after living here a couple of months.

There are plenty of things to enjoy here too but don't expect to be able to live like a princess on 200 pounds a month. BsAs is pretty darn expensive for a third world city (and that is what it is when it comes down to it), so come down here with enough money to last you a year even if you can't find a job this whole time.

And bring cash. Don't leave your money in your bank account and withdraw it on a regualr basis. Doing that would be just stupid. Bringing in cash will make your conversion rate 30-40% better depending on the day.

Be smart, enjoy and don't burn all bridges if you make the move.

Good luck.

 

[Gringoboy]

Its like this -

If you want first class shopping experiences, good choice of mid range restaurants and cheap mobile telephones BA is not for you, however, if you like the idea of not being surrounded by Louis Vuitton'd Starbucks toting i-clones, decent high end restaurants, cheap cigarettes, friendly enough people, good choice of bars and clubs, good looking people (not all), cheap rents, cheap taxis, choice of theaters (albeit seasonal), I could go on but I am sure you get the point, I think you will find BA just fine.

I would not take as gospel anything read on here as a lot of posters seem to be disillusioned with the place for their inability to purchase some product or other from their home country or the unfriendly nature of the locals. The fact is it is what you make it.

A traveler came upon an old farmer hoeing in his field beside the road. Eager to rest his feet, the wanderer hailed the countryman, who seemed happy enough to straighten his back and talk for a moment.
"What sort of people live in the next town?" asked the stranger.

"What were the people like where you've come from?" replied the farmer, answering the question with another question.

"They were a bad lot. Troublemakers all, and lazy too. The most selfish people in the world, and not a one of them to be trusted. I'm happy to be leaving the scoundrels."

"Is that so?" replied the old farmer. "Well, I'm afraid that you'll find the same sort in the next town.

Disappointed, the traveler trudged on his way, and the farmer returned to his work.

Some time later another stranger, coming from the same direction, hailed the farmer, and they stopped to talk. "What sort of people live in the next town?" he asked.

"What were the people like where you've come from?" replied the farmer once again.

"They were the best people in the world. Hard working, honest, and friendly. I'm sorry to be leaving them."

"Fear not," said the farmer. "You'll find the same sort in the next town."

I like that analogy very much.
A bit like getting out of bed the wrong side in the morning and nobody can do anything right. Alternatively, when you get out of bed the right side and....................well, you get my drift.