Why Does Everyone Here Seem To Hate Buenos Aires So Much?

[Chicaargentina]

First i wanna introduce myself, my name is Luciana and i live in Buenos Aires (im not originally from here, but from Mar del Plata, and came to live to BA one year ago), im argentinian. I read this forum once in a while to see what foreingers think about this city, to practice my english reading skills, and to read recommendations of good places to go (since i dont know any forum in spanish with such an active community and in where such topics are discussed).

I entered the other day after long time without entering this forum (months, maybe a year) and i notice a HUGE negativity, i didnt remember this forum was like this before? Not only most people open topics complaining how BA is bad in just about EVERYTHING (is that even possible, really?), but if someone actually wants to bring some positivity to the forum and post nice things about the city, it get millons of mocks from forumers, or people react angered to a person that actually wanted to say one or two nice things about the city.

I know this city has many bad things, BELIEVE ME, i know , it is still hard for me to adapt, and if i had to use a word to define this city, that word would be "chaotic". And its dirty, and everything is a mess, and burocracy sucks,and the long and hot summers, and did i mention is dirty? and traffic omg, and, well, many other things. I get it. This place is no paradise. But does this really have to go as far as to react so angry when someone says one nice thing about this city?? Because this does not seem a discussion forum anymore, more like a BASHING forum, theres no discussion anymore .

While I recognize many of the downsides of this city, i find it hilarious that people here complain about how rude people are, seriously?? Argentinians love anything foreingers from northamerica or europe, and they seem to make an effort to be liked by them. If anything, they can be accused of being tilingos (sorry, dont know the translation for that one :lol: ), but not nice? thats like the most surreal thing i ve ever heard. Rude?? I traveled to many places and nothing here can be labeled as rude. Are they stressed out people in this chaotic city? OF COURSE, can people in some places be nasty? obviously. But are, argentinians, or lats say porteños, generally rude? of course not, thats probably one of the most ridiculous thing i ve ever read.

And the pizza-bashing is something i seriously dont understand. I lived in USA and pizza there is actual crap. Lived in Italy and the best pizza wasnt as good as some pizzas in Buenos Aires (one guy said this in other forum and you guys wanted to lynch him!!!).
BA really does have little offer in food and we have A LOT to learn from USA in that respect, but beef, pizza and ice cream....are you joking?? People in the food thread didnt even wanna recognize ice creams here are delicious!!!


If this city is SO horrible and terrible and people are so incredibly mean and rude, SO MUCH that you cant even enjoy the out of the world delicious ice creams that are made in the millon ice cream places all over the city, cause you hate everything else SO MUCH, why dont you live?


I get it, i get it, you are gonna bash me no end now. Im new to the forum. Im not an expat. Whatever. But i really used to love reading this forum and advices and experiences and now all i read is people HATING. hating so much that they cant even recognize the little good things that are actually good in the city. Like people and ice cream, lol :lol:

 

[nlaruccia]

One can understand being an Argentinean and entering this form to find a lot of Argentine bashing posts how you could not take it personally. Maybe you're right, people that don't like it should move. However, because of work, spouses and children many cannot leave Argentina. Expats have become more negative lately, but then again so have the portenos here. Not a day goes by when I don't hear an Argentinean complain about this "pais de mierda". Every social reunion and function I attend always consists of Argentineans bashing this country, government, policy, economy, culture, etc. I think it's safe to say "everyone" has become more negative.......and for good reason.

 

[esllou]

people use the forum to sound off - you're going to get a more concentrated negative vibe in here for that reason. It's basically distilled griping. It's like expecting a fair and balanced political discussion on DemsForSaintObama.com or WeLoveRGunsNReligion.com, never gonna happen....

the other thing is that people aren't always here 100% by choice, as nlaruccia alludes to. That makes people super grouchy.

And also, the situation is changing for the negative - you'd have to be an ostrich with your head in quick set cement not to realise that. This also creates a build up of negativity as people compare the situation here to 2006, 2009 or whatever. Surprising as it sounds, not being allowed to buy dollars freely (or any of a hundred other things that have deteriorated in last couple of years) can get people angry about a lot of other stuff. It's not always logical, but there you go.

 

[Joe]

First i wanna introduce myself, my name is Luciana and i live in Buenos Aires (im not originally from here, but from Mar del Plata, and came to live to BA one year ago), im argentinian. I read this forum once in a while to see what foreingers think about this city, to practice my english reading skills, and to read recommendations of good places to go (since i dont know any forum in spanish with such an active community and in where such topics are discussed).

So true! They should change the name of this forum from BAexpats.com to ExpatsBashBA.com.

BTW I love Mar del Plata - at least the three months of the year it isn't cold and cloudy. And the best part of Mardel: it doesn't totally suck like BA.

 

[camberiu]

But are, argentinians, or lats say porteños, generally rude? of course not, thats probably one of the most ridiculous thing i ve ever read.

You are right. This is totally uncalled for. Porteño drivers are known for being very courteous on the road, always respecting other drivers, the rules of transit and specially the pedestrians. It is truly heart warming to see the dog owners here always picking up after their dogs, so that we pedestrians never need to worry about steeping on dog shit. Porteño are also very considerate towards their neighbors. They never play loud music during late weeknights, dont' slam doors or anything else that might disrupt or bother their neighbors that have to work early next day. Porteños never cut lines, or try to skip turns. Never. Finally, they treat tourists (specially Brazilians) really well, never overcharging them, always giving directions when asked or never trying to pass false bills.
Those kinds of things of course can be expected in countries of uneducated populations and low HDI, like Equador, Peru or Paraguay. Thankfully, the people here are highly educated and have a HDI of near European levels, so we don;t need to worry about those things.

Indeed, this prejudice against Porteños is all a lie. Vivenza criolla is an urban legend and it does not correspond to the reality of Buenos Aires.

 

[Smcali23]

Sometimes, when loads of people agree on something, they have a point.

You don't have to agree with that point, but I think it's fair to say (in this case) the negativity didn't spring out of nowhere.

 

[Illinoisjoe]

bien dicho, Luciana! I find this site both extremely useful for the practical advice and knowledge of the community, and extremely frustrating for the snarkiness (I don't know how to translate *that*), judgements, and complaining about the city. It would be a fair point that I haven't lived here as long as some, and I am certainly not one of those who is trapped here due to employment or a spouse, but I too do not understand the level of hatred many expats here seem to have for a country that they must have "chosen", on some level.

As for the pizza and ice cream: I think you are basically right, but the thing is both of them are different here and people who are homesick sometimes hate things just because they are different than they are used to and what they miss. Food especially is something we always get nostalgic for and something people form strong opinions about based on early experiences, no? For my part, the thing that is really great in Buenos Aires are the facturas y empanadas artesenales. The parrillas are of course great too, but many things Argentinians are proud of or assume are the best (like ice cream, dulce de leche, and alfajores) are not so great or are at least overrated, in my humble opinion.

I think the complaining that bothers me most on this site is the negative stuff about the culture of Buenos Aires or the generalizations about the people here. Again, I am not a "real" expat because in total I've only spent about 10 months here, but I think this has to be wrong and not unlike the ice cream/ pizza problem: there is a different culture here and people who miss their own culture fixate and focus on the negative aspects of the culture here. Every country has lazy people, ignorant people, and untrustworthy people as well as hard working, smart, honest people. On some level I think people's impressions of the people here is a mirror to themselves: If you think everyone in Buenos Aires is an asshole, that might be saying more about the people you've chosen to associate with than the city as a whole. This is a huge city, so I think if you don't like the people you've encountered here, you should find some different ones.

Of course, we are all forced to deal with unsavory people. And perhaps that happens for some here more than others. In general, I think the people here are quite friendly and I love the amount of TALKING that happens here relative to my native country (US). You can say that this is just newbie expat shine that will wear off once I step in my fourth pile of dog shit, but I say there is a positive way and a negative way to look at a place as chaotic, big, and diverse as BsAs. The question is why do so many people here prefer the latter?

 

[Joe]

You are right. This is totally uncalled for. Porteño drivers are known for being very courteous on the road, always respecting other drivers, the rules of transit and specially the pedestrians.

In all Third World countries, the pedestrian is always a second class citizen.

The world's politest drivers? Maybe Canadians. If I even contemplate entering an intersection the Canadian slams on his brakes - it actually a little annoying... But in BA you either have to watch for the poo or the cars - you can't do both!

 

[expatinowncountry]

Hi Luciana, Do not take things in this board personally. This is my second time living in Buenos Aires (with a ten years break in between) and I always have the love and hate relation with the place. I have shared both positive and negative experiences in this forum. I was an active member here when I just moved because I wanted information and relate to fellow expats but I got tired of all the negativity and the nonsense in this site. Not everyone in this site is like that but there are a dozen members who are a pain in the ass.

Porteños are sometimes rude like people in almost every big city in the world. Controlling by city size, I think people are overall nice and welcoming. We have two young children and people go a long way to make our life easier. People lets go ahead in the queues. My wife always get a sear in the bus or metro (in Paris where we are from, that would never, never happens). We can have lunch in most restaurants. There are many positive other things I could think of (like we live very comfortable on a share of our budget at home) and of course some negatives. I know we are not in Buenos Aires for the long run, so I am trying to enjoy the most all the positives and survive the negatives.

Sometimes I ask myself who are we (the expats). You could imagine that a lot of us are well educated so we were able to become "tradable goods" and work in countries other than ours. Some have special talents that are on demand here. Others, curious mind that decide that the world was their home... and a few are here because they got married to a local (so they have love in their life, what is not a minor point). Overall I would expect that the average expat is worldly open mind person. However when you read what you read here.... I realize that my mental model of the average expat is totally wrong. Some people are here because they are escaping from their own mediocrity and feel that Argentina owns them something when in most cases is the other way around. Here we are welcomed and thanks to the nicest immigration law in the world we are able to stay.

In any case Luciana, as a long term expat, I can tell you that all the expat forum work the same way in the world. I have lived in many countries and bashing the country and the local is a favorite pastime among expats. Do not take it personally.

 

[cbonanni]

I love Buenos AIres !! Discussion for the sake of knowledge is wonderful. Everyone is entitled to their opinion. Just goes to show the intelligence , or extreme lack thereof , in the opinions expressed within this forum.

Besides , it's fun to complain. It is the idiots who take it personally and rant that is detracting. I have a choice to read what posts I want , and ignore those I know will be ridiculous.