Changes for "permatourists"

steveinbsas said:
For several months I have been asking if there is a difference between changes in the laws and changes in policy. Thanks for clearing that up!

You welcome.

steveinbsas said:
Not everyone has a blog and some of us have names that are far too common to find a specific individual using a google search. I'm not working, but here's my blog, anyway:

I am a milonguero and a have many friends who are perma-tourists. Some of them are dancing at the streets and posting their pictures in FB. So, this is only an advice.

Regards
 
Thanks bajo-cero, I had come to the same conclusions so ... wait and see.

Nevertheless, after rereading for a third time both the decreto and the ley, it seems to me that there is a major loophole/flaw in the text. If I'm right, maybe I'm not, then the will to establish a very clear & complete text is a failure (a relative one though) :p .

Anyway, this possible loophole could be easily fixed by another decreto or maybe even by the DNM, although I don't know if the DNM has the authority to take such a decision.

I wonder if I should post this possible loop-hole here or not (can I send you a PM bajo-cero with what I think is the loop-hole ?).

Maybe I'm wrong

EDIT : maybe this loophole is deliberate though
 
Okay, then what I thought could be a loophole is not.

What I thought was :
- Before the decreto 616/2010 : The law 25.871 was using decretos published before (from 1977,1994,1995,...) hence the hectic situation. Furthermore arts 122 and 124 of law 25.871 tell that although the new law creates a new situation, previous decretos would still apply until a new one was passed.
- After the decreto 616/2010 : art.2 tells that this decreto derogates to previous decretos (1977,94,95...) which is consistent with arts 122 and 124 of ley 25.871.
Therefore it's like if a new situation was created from the scratch, hence the essence of the new decreto.

Now I was surprised to read art.24 of the new decreto :
ARTICULO 24.- Los extranjeros que ingresen al país como "residentes transitorios" podrán ser admitidos en las subcategorías establecidas por el artículo 24 de la Ley Nº 25.871, con los siguientes alcances:
a) Turistas: quienes ingresen con propósito de descanso o esparcimiento, con plazo de permanencia de hasta TRES (3) meses, prorrogables por otro período similar


while nowhere could be found a text mentionning that turists (e.g.) could not stay for more than 180 days per year.

Of course, it could be argued that a turist staying in Argentina for 340 days a year could not reasonably be considered as a turist, but still, no precise mention has been made.
So, in fact, I wondered if a turist could legally (everything that is not forbidden by law is legal) come here for 90 days, prorrogate the visa for +90 days, exit the country for 1 day, reenter as a turist for a new cycle (like before in fact).

---
Asking bajo-cero, he replied something I had overlooked (anyway it's about the same thing about defining a turist that would stay here for 340 days a year) :
ARTICULO 61.- Cuando se verifique que un extranjero hubiere desnaturalizado los motivos que autorizaron su ingreso al territorio argentino o permaneciera en éste vencido el plazo de permanencia acordado,

According to him, I agree, it's even less permissive since the authorities could even annoy someone who would stay here only 180 days a year.


.... So no loophole, sorry :p
 
I'm not a lawyer nor do I play one on tv;) but I still think that's a pretty big loophole.

What about someone (I happen to know the person) who came here for a year to learn polo. Not working, no desire to do so, no intention of staying in Argentina long-term, no desire for bank accounts, etc.

He isn't hiding his motives - just wants to stay for an extended period of time to learn polo. And adheres to the rules about stay (leaving after 90 days, etc.)

So I'm pretty sure he could argue his case if he had any problems.

Shrug - I just think that the easiest thing to do to close the loophole (if that is their intent) is simply to put 180 limit. Then there can't be any gray area.
 
Bajo_cero2 said:
Ghost, "permatourist " :D:D:D Come on!

About CFK, this new law, if you go to the migration office at Retiro, there is a big sign with the slogan "If you are illegal, that´s because you want to". It makes no sense to be illegal, if you have your life here and the goverment gives you the way to became a resident, lucky you. Mexican are not so lucky at the US. On the other hand, if there is a deportation order against you, you will spend a lot of money in lawyers when you can deal with this for 600 pesos and some paperwork.

Regards
Thanks Bajo, but I don't go to the immigration offices anymore and have not for some years. I am a legal and permanant resident. And I'm glad it's done.
 
citygirl said:
I'm not a lawyer nor do I play one on tv;) but I still think that's a pretty big loophole.

What about someone (I happen to know the person) who came here for a year to learn polo. Not working, no desire to do so, no intention of staying in Argentina long-term, no desire for bank accounts, etc.

He isn't hiding his motives - just wants to stay for an extended period of time to learn polo. And adheres to the rules about stay (leaving after 90 days, etc.)

So I'm pretty sure he could argue his case if he had any problems.

Shrug - I just think that the easiest thing to do to close the loophole (if that is their intent) is simply to put 180 limit. Then there can't be any gray area.

I'm not a lawyer neither even if I studied to be a criminal one (never practiced) :p

Well art. 61 mentionned above is even more restrictive since it gives a discretionnary power to migraciones to decide if you are suspect or not
(if you are, they give you 30 days, etc...).
Of course, I don't think this will be severely enforced but still, it's the ground for further -poential- developments.
 
French jurist said:
Well art. 61 mentionned above is even more restrictive since it gives a discretionnary power to migraciones to decide if you are suspect or not
(if you are, they give you 30 days, etc...).

What could make one a greater "suspect" than multiple entry stamps that add up to multiple years living in Argentina on the tourist visa?:(
 
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