Rentista visa and some other questions

[steveinbsas]

...if I can't prove to Peru/Argentina that my income is sufficient, Mexico is always an option due to them taking bank statements for $40,000

I lived in Mexico for five years before arriving in Argentina in early May of 2006, and afrom November of 2000 to May of 2006 I lived in one of the best places in Mexico where a Gringo could live (Sayulita, Nayarit).

I returned in early 2007 for two weeks to bring some items that I had left behind in case I did not want to actually "move" to Argentina.

Since then I have had no desire whatsoever to return to Mexico, even for a visit.

To put it simply, life (at least for me) is SO much better than it ever was in Mexico.

 

[lunar]

EDIT: I'm reading conflicting information: that Argentina has dual citizenship and that they don't and that I'd have to renounce my US citizenship. Any clarification?

Where did you get this idea from? Significant number of Argentines have second citizenship from some European country. I've never heard that any person getting Argentine citizenship had to get rid his other citizenship.

 

[sts7049]

at one time my girlfriend was a dutch citizen (she was born there) and moved to arg very young.

when she became an arg citizen my understanding is she was forced to give up the dutch one.

 

[steveinbsas]

Okay, so I'm looking at the website of Bajo_Cero_2...these Argentinian laws are so hard to understand. One thing that is written there is that for the rentista visa, there has to be $2000 a month in income, which I don't actually meet. is this still true or is there wiggle room?

I believe It has been a number of years since migraciones actually published a monthly income requirement for the visa rentista on their website.

Here's a little history that might clear thing up a bit (or perhaps not):

When I applied for temporary residency in 2006, the published monthly income requirmet for the visa rentista was $2000 pesos. At an exchange rate of just over 3 to one, that was less than $700 per month.

In 2010, when the exchange rate was 4 to one the monthly income requirment was increased to $8000 pesos ($2000 USD) per month. and the new rate aplied to renewals is as well as first time applicants.

During the next four years the exchange rate continually improved in favor of the US dollar, so the monthy income requirment in USD gradually declined. Just pror to the next increase. the monthly income requirement in dollars had fallen to about $535 USD .

In 2014 the monthly income requirment for the visa rentista incresed from $8000 to $30.000 peos. The exchange rate at the time was 15 to one, so the monthly income requirement once again increased to the equilalent of $2000 USD per month.

That amount also declined in USD as the peso lost value during the following years, but migracioes apparently contiuned to use the $30.000 peso per month income requirement for a number of years.

I beleive that when RADEX first went into effect, migraciones stopped publishing a fixed monthly income requirmenfor the visa rentista in pesos, but I have no idea when or how often they have actuallly increased that amount since then.

It might actually be the case that they stopped using a fixed peso amount and they began using the fixed dollar amount of $2000 to calculate the monthly requirment in pesos, even though it is no longer published on the migraciones website.

I don't think that any of this is something you need to be concerned about as it appears to me that the pensioner visa (with no fixed monthly income requirment) is the one you should apply for in the first place.

 

[steveinbsas]

When I applied for temporary residency in 2006, the published monthly income requirmet for the visa rentista was $2000 pesos. At an exchange rate of just over 3 to one, that was less than $700 per month.

I am not certain, but the $2000 pesos per month requirment for the visa rentista could have been first established when the dollar and the peso were pegged at one to one, thus making the monthly income requirment at that time $2000 USD as well as $2000 ARS:

When I applied for what I thought at the time was the "visa rentista" in 2006 I provided migraciones with sufficint evidnce that I had a monthly income of $1000 USD per month which was then caluclated to be over $3000 ARS, more than enough to meet the $2000 pesos per month requirement.

I would not discover until 2009 that I never actually had the visa rentista. According to the woman who I dealt withat migracione for all three of my remewals, as far as migraciones was concerned, I had the pensioner visa from the start.

She only used the word "pensioner" when I said I would like to make the cambio de categoria from temporary residency to permanent on the third renweal. Before this, I believe I had only asked to renew my temporary residency, not renew my "visa rentista" so until this point, I never actually knew the difference.

 

[steveinbsas]

So if I'm understanding this correctly: I add a notarized cover letter to the documents and have that whole document apostilled. I do this for every document: For example:

1. Notarized letter from the lawyer who did the settlement, attach it to the settlement, and get that whole document apostilled.

You only have to have the "cover letter" from the lawyer receive the Apostille. The letter should be on the law firm's letterhead, The lawyer should refer to the "attached" settlement in the letter, clearly describe the source of the monthly income and that it will continue for the rest of your life. I suggest you have the lawyer include your date of birth and your current passport number in the letter and refer to you with the same name as on your passport.

2. Notarized letter from the bank showing consistent deposits of the same amount of money for as long as I've had the account, get that apostilled and attach bank statements and the receipt as you stated above.

The letter shoud be written on stationery with the bank's letterhead and include the bank officer's name and title. If possible, it should be as specific as possible regarding how long you have been receiving the funds for the monthly depoits as well as the excact source of the deposits (an insurance company or the issuer of the annuity). The letter shoud include your full name and it should match the name on the account.

I suggest you have the bank officer include your date of birth and your passport number in the letter as well as the account number and when it was opened. The signature of the bank officer must be notarized and the letter can receive the Apostille. Bank statements can't receive the Apostlle. You can attach the bank statemets after the letter recieves the Apostille

3. Notarized letter from me, stating the whole situation and why it is so complicated and attach that to the letter from the insurance company stating the annuity amount and that it's issued for life, get that apostilled.

I don't think it will be necessary or acceptable for you to write your own letter of explaination. If you can get a signed by an insurance company official that verrifies (and refers to) the settlement in the letter, that can be notarized and recieve the Apostille. Hopefuly that letter cn also include your curret passport number, At the least, it should include the exact same name as on your passport as well as your date of birth.

I suggest that you "build your case" based on facts presented and documented by those in a postion of authority to do so.

Then get it all translated by a certified Argentinian translator, gather all the other required documents, go to a lawyer and that's it, I'll either get approved for the visa or be in limbo long enough to get citizenship?

You will need to have translations for the Apostilled letters as well as any attached docs they refer to (that you have actually attached after the letters recieve the Apostille).

 

[UraniumFever]

You only have to have the "cover letter" from the lawyer receive the Apostille. The letter should be on the law firm's letterhead, The lawyer should refer to the "attached" settlement in the letter, clearly describe the source of the monthly income and that it will continue for the rest of your life. I suggest you have the lawyer include your date of birth and your current passport number in the letter and refer to you with the same name as on your passport.



The letter shoud be written on stationery with the bank's letterhead and include the bank officer's name and title. If possible, it should be as specific as possible regarding how long you have been receiving the funds for the monthly depoits as well as the excact source of the deposits (an insurance company or the issuer of the annuity). The letter shoud include your full name and it should match the name on the account.

I suggest you have the bank officer include your date of birth and your passport number in the letter as well as the account number and when it was opened. The signature of the bank officer must be notarized and the letter can receive the Apostille. Bank statements can't receive the Apostlle. You can attach the bank statemets after the letter recieves the Apostille



I don't think it will be necessary or acceptable for you to write your own letter of explaination. If you can get a signed by an insurance company official that verrifies (and refers to) the settlement in the letter, that can be notarized and recieve the Apostille. Hopefuly that letter cn also include your curret passport number, At the least, it should include the exact same name as on your passport as well as your date of birth.

I suggest that you "build your case" based on facts presented and documented by those in a postion of authority to do so.



You will need to have translations for the Apostilled letters as well as any attached docs they refer to (that you have actually attached after the letters recieve the Apostille).

Unfortunately, my main issue is that the insurance company is seemingly run by idiots who refuse to notarize any document (which seems preposterous, as I'm sure I'm not the first person to request this). I recently sent them a fax requesting this, we'll have to see what they say.

In terms of the bank letter, I've had an account with them for over 3 years, all of those having 1 payment per month as per the settlement. I'm 100% sure that I can get a letter verifying that.

If I can get a letter from the lawyer, I'm not sure. I'll have to call and ask.

I'm sorry if I'm making any sort of mistake, today is a holiday so I'm drunk

EDIT: Just called the law firm and asked if they have any documentation about the case, if they do, it will be a massive help to my case.

 

[steveinbsas]

If I was in your shoes I would get out of Russia ASAP and come directly to Argentina.

Unfortunately, my main issue is that the insurance company is seemingly run by idiots who refuse to notarize any document (which seems preposterous, as I'm sure I'm not the first person to request this). I recently sent them a fax requesting this, we'll have to see what they say.

Have you made it clear that you are not asking the insurance compny to have any documents notarized?

You are (or should be) asking them to write a letter stating facts (about which you can be very specific in your request) amd to have the signature of the person who signs the letter notarized.

In terms of the bank letter, I've had an account with them for over 3 years, all of those having 1 payment per month as per the settlement. I'm 100% sure that I can get a letter verifying that.

I provided a bank officer at my hometown bank with a draft of exactly what I wanted the letter to specify. It was done exactly as I requested and although there was no charge for this service, I would have gladly paid for it.

If I can get a letter from the lawyer, I'm not sure. I'll have to call and ask.

The lawyer who wrote the original trust wrote the letter I needed for migracions and she had to bill me one hour for doing this ($450 USD very well spent).

 

[UraniumFever]

If I was in your shoes I would get out of Russia ASAP and come directly to Argentina.

Have you made it clear that you are not asking the insurance compny to have any documents notarized?

You are (or should be) asking them to write a letter stating facts (about which you can be very specific in your request) amd to have the signature of the person who signs the letter notarized.



I provided a bank officer at my hometown bank with a draft of exactly what I wanted the letter to specify. It was done exactly as I requested and although there was no charge for this service, I would have gladly paid for it.



The lawyer who wrote the original trust wrote the letter I needed for migracions and she had to bill me one hour for doing this ($450 USD very well spent).

I looked up the lawyer who settled the case...he died 3 years ago...I called the actual law firm he worked for to see if they have this document in their files (the case is from 2000 but I was a minor so it's possible they were required to keep it).
In terms of the insurance company, they told me over the phone that they don't even have a notary in their office (which seems extremely far fetched for an insurance company) but that might be in the support department. I sent them a fax so I'll know soon enough.

In terms of the bank, they said they could write a letter about the fact that I get a consistent amount of money regularly and notarize it.

It might just be the perfect set of circumstances that makes this impossible to actually prove. I'll have to wait for either the insurance company or law firm to respond, but I might be dung out of luck here.

If the lawyer needs me to pay money to get the letter, I have literally no issue paying them a $1000 to do it.

 

[steveinbsas]

I looked up the lawyer who settled the case...he died 3 years ago...I called the actual law firm he worked for to see if they have this document in their files (the case is from 2000 but I was a minor so it's possible they were required to keep it).
In terms of the insurance company, they told me over the phone that they don't even have a notary in their office (which seems extremely far fetched for an insurance company) but that might be in the support department. I sent them a fax so I'll know soon enough.

In terms of the bank, they said they could write a letter about the fact that I get a consistent amount of money regularly and notarize it.

It might just be the perfect set of circumstances that makes this impossible to actually prove. I'll have to wait for either the insurance company or law firm to respond, but I might be dung out of luck here.

If the lawyer needs me to pay money to get the letter, I have literally no issue paying them a $1000 to do it.

If all else fails (and even if it doesn't) I would seriously consider asking a CPA in the USA to examine the letter form the insurance company (even if the signature isn't notarized) as well as your bank statements and the letter from the bank and verify that in a letter, provided the CPA is willing to have his or her signature notarized.

If the first CPA you ask isn't willing to have thier signature notarized, keep asking until you find one who is.

Based on posts I've read in the past, Argentine migraciones accepts income verrification like this when provided by a CPA on the firm's letterhead and the letter has the Apostille as a result of the signature being notarized.

The biggest problem I remember someone posting about regarding a verification letter from a CPA was the CPA's "unwillingness" to guarantee that the income (from rental properties) would continue in the future, but your annuity based income is obviously far more "secure" and likely to continue in the future than income from rents.

I think the quadruple verification by the lawyer, the bank and a CPA along with the letter from the insurance compny if it is referenced in the lawyer's or the CPA's letter will be enough for migraciones to grant you the pensioner visa

I believe the letter from the insurance company can be attached to and then translated into Spanish if it is mentioned in the letter from the CPA and possibly by the bank as well if you can get the bank officer to mention the inurance company by name as the sender of the deposits to you bank account.

Perhaps the first question you should ask an "immigration attorney" before proceding further is if there is a minimum age limit for the pensioner visa. I would ask this question of three attorneys as well as how mcuh they will charge to represent you at migraciones (go with you and act as your interpreter when you have the interview in person).