Venting on BAexpats...

[Greg S]

The income distribution is already much worse in Argentina than the US.

Palermo Chico is not a bad place to ride it out, either is Beacon Hill or the West Village.

St Louis is not an ideal city, but you can't compare it to BA. That's like the equivalent of La Pampa. A city I wouldn't want to live in either.

Have you spent much time in the USA over the past 2 years?

 

[Greg S]

Have you spent much time in the USA over the past 2 years?

The income distribution is already much worse in Argentina than the US.

Palermo Chico is not a bad place to ride it out, either is Beacon Hill or the West Village.

St Louis is not an ideal city, but you can't compare it to BA. That's like the equivalent of La Pampa. A city I wouldn't want to live in either.

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Do you want to see the number of homeless in la, NYC, Seattle, SF? The crime in those areas,?

Don't be naive. The USA is a economically and racially divided nation. As never before.

 

[Dougie]

Yes I have and I find most parts of NYC and Boston to be much safer than Buenos Aires.

The USA is becoming more unequal economically, but Argentina is magnitudes poorer with high levels of poverty and income inequality. It's not even close.

All that being said I do love Buenos Aires.

 

[semigoodlookin]

There seems to be a lot of "if you don't like it, leave" being thrown around when I don't recall anyone in the thread saying they don't like Argentina. Seeing the problems in something is not equal to disliking it. I can see the problems in my chess game, discuss them, analyze them, and bemoan them. That doesn't mean I don't like my chess game or should just stop playing. It's a good ability for those who don't see problems in anything, but I do see problems in things and try to discuss them or solve them. It's not the same as disliking something.

Also, this is a forum on Argentina. I don't think I have ever been to a forum that is not at least 50% people moaning about bullshit.

 

[antipodean]

Vent mode on.
It's only Tuesday and so far this week:

• Argentina appoints an ambassador to support the dictatorship of Assad in Syria
• Ex-secretary of public works who was caught red handed with $9m of stollen money and an automatic weapon at a convent provisionally released from jail
• Argentina breaks another record of daily COVID infections
• Argentina plans joint military exercises with China
• Convicted ex-president Boudou giving classes at UBA from home detention
• More "VIP" vaccination tales - of a 24 year old
• Court dismisses a major corruption case against CFK and Axel K amidst judicial "reform" and "pressure"
• Government resort to their own popular markets to offer food at affordable prices to impoverished Argentines that it can no longer afford to pay to feed themselves (a la Venezuela model)
• Government umming and ahing about rising minimum salary to less than US$150 a month - still one of the lowest on the continent
• The brecha is increasing again - now at 54%
• Government threatening the ban meat exports amidst food crisis affecting poor and looming elections
• Am Cham threatening exit of more foreign companies from Argentina due to government price control policies
• New more dangerous COVID strains circulating freely in the community
• Teacher's union announces strike for Wednesday further disrupting classrooms
• Shots fired at house of Hebe de Bonafini
• Inflation on track to be higher this year than last
• News that more people have been murdered by recently released prisoners than prisoners dead of COVID
• Government discards more IFE payments to most vulnerable (presumably no hay plata)

Meanwhile in the background of all this chaos:

• Since AF came to power 20 K prisoners charged with corruption have been released from prison
• Increasing murmers in Europe that Argentina is complicit in the biggest drug shipment in European history - 16 tons via BA with love
• Poverty keeps getting worse
• Government does not want to play by the democratic rules it set in the first place
• Argentina condemned by international human rights organisations but does nothing about it
• Insecurity is getting worse
• Where is some serious positive momentum at least?

I'm pretty used to Argentina over the years being ...dramatic... even at the best of times.
However the nature and frequency of such events really makes one ask what trajectory this country is actually on.
For a country that is supposed to be building confidence to rebuild the economy, they are doing a good job at pushing it into negative territory by creating unnecessary contradiction and division.

No wonder so many young Argentines just stop seeing a future here and leave - headlines like these just don't look like those in any serious country where the average-joe can have a nice, safe, free, fair and calm life - or at least a tangible chance at it. These kind of complaints just are not comparable to complaining about the occasional power-cut or not being about to get ones favourite shampoo in stores.
On the positive side (hopefully) we have elections later this year.

 

[Ronnie Hotdogs]

Vent mode on.
It's only Tuesday and so far this week:

• Argentina appoints an ambassador to support the dictatorship of Assad in Syria
• Ex-secretary of public works who was caught red handed with $9m of stollen money and an automatic weapon at a convent provisionally released from jail
• Argentina breaks another record of daily COVID infections
• Argentina plans joint military exercises with China
• Convicted ex-president Boudou giving classes at UBA from home detention
• More "VIP" vaccination tales - of a 24 year old
• Court dismisses a major corruption case against CFK and Axel K amidst judicial "reform" and "pressure"
• Government resort to their own popular markets to offer food at affordable prices to impoverished Argentines that it can no longer afford to pay to feed themselves (a la Venezuela model)
• Government umming and ahing about rising minimum salary to less than US$150 a month - still one of the lowest on the continent
• The brecha is increasing again - now at 54%
• Government threatening the ban meat exports amidst food crisis affecting poor and looming elections
• Am Cham threatening exit of more foreign companies from Argentina due to government price control policies
• New more dangerous COVID strains circulating freely in the community
• Teacher's union announces strike for Wednesday further disrupting classrooms
• Shots fired at house of Hebe de Bonafini
• Inflation on track to be higher this year than last
• News that more people have been murdered by recently released prisoners than prisoners dead of COVID
• Government discards more IFE payments to most vulnerable (presumably no hay plata)

Meanwhile in the background of all this chaos:

• Since AF came to power 20 K prisoners charged with corruption have been released from prison
• Increasing murmers in Europe that Argentina is complicit in the biggest drug shipment in European history - 16 tons via BA with love
• Poverty keeps getting worse
• Government does not want to play by the democratic rules it set in the first place
• Argentina condemned by international human rights organisations but does nothing about it
• Insecurity is getting worse
• Where is some serious positive momentum at least?

I'm pretty used to Argentina over the years being ...dramatic... even at the best of times.
However the nature and frequency of such events really makes one ask what trajectory this country is actually on.
For a country that is supposed to be building confidence to rebuild the economy, they are doing a good job at pushing it into negative territory by creating unnecessary contradiction and division.

No wonder so many young Argentines just stop seeing a future here and leave - headlines like these just don't look like those in any serious country where the average-joe can have a nice, safe, free, fair and calm life - or at least a tangible chance at it. These kind of complaints just are not comparable to complaining about the occasional power-cut or not being about to get ones favourite shampoo in stores.
On the positive side (hopefully) we have elections later this year.

When you put it like that it sounds pretty bad!

 

[antipodean]

When you put it like that it sounds pretty bad!

Ya cerraron diez sanatorios privados en el conurbano y temen por una “estatización silenciosa”

Ya cerraron diez sanatorios privados en el conurbano y temen por una “estatización silenciosa”

www.lanacion.com.ar

Don't worry, it gets better. We can also add the recent closure (mid pandemic) of more than 10 private hospitals in AMBA due to the government essentially driving them out of business by forcing regulation of prices while allowing them to increase their fees by only 13% when they face cost increases in excess of 50% ... all the while ideas of "nationalisation" of the entire healthcare system are being floated or coming back to the surface.

 

[Alpinista]

Vent mode on.
It's only Tuesday and so far this week:

• Argentina appoints an ambassador to support the dictatorship of Assad in Syria
• Ex-secretary of public works who was caught red handed with $9m of stollen money and an automatic weapon at a convent provisionally released from jail
• Argentina breaks another record of daily COVID infections
• Argentina plans joint military exercises with China
• Convicted ex-president Boudou giving classes at UBA from home detention
• More "VIP" vaccination tales - of a 24 year old
• Court dismisses a major corruption case against CFK and Axel K amidst judicial "reform" and "pressure"
• Government resort to their own popular markets to offer food at affordable prices to impoverished Argentines that it can no longer afford to pay to feed themselves (a la Venezuela model)
• Government umming and ahing about rising minimum salary to less than US$150 a month - still one of the lowest on the continent
• The brecha is increasing again - now at 54%
• Government threatening the ban meat exports amidst food crisis affecting poor and looming elections
• Am Cham threatening exit of more foreign companies from Argentina due to government price control policies
• New more dangerous COVID strains circulating freely in the community
• Teacher's union announces strike for Wednesday further disrupting classrooms
• Shots fired at house of Hebe de Bonafini
• Inflation on track to be higher this year than last
• News that more people have been murdered by recently released prisoners than prisoners dead of COVID
• Government discards more IFE payments to most vulnerable (presumably no hay plata)

Meanwhile in the background of all this chaos:

• Since AF came to power 20 K prisoners charged with corruption have been released from prison
• Increasing murmers in Europe that Argentina is complicit in the biggest drug shipment in European history - 16 tons via BA with love
• Poverty keeps getting worse
• Government does not want to play by the democratic rules it set in the first place
• Argentina condemned by international human rights organisations but does nothing about it
• Insecurity is getting worse
• Where is some serious positive momentum at least?

I'm pretty used to Argentina over the years being ...dramatic... even at the best of times.
However the nature and frequency of such events really makes one ask what trajectory this country is actually on.
For a country that is supposed to be building confidence to rebuild the economy, they are doing a good job at pushing it into negative territory by creating unnecessary contradiction and division.

No wonder so many young Argentines just stop seeing a future here and leave - headlines like these just don't look like those in any serious country where the average-joe can have a nice, safe, free, fair and calm life - or at least a tangible chance at it. These kind of complaints just are not comparable to complaining about the occasional power-cut or not being about to get ones favourite shampoo in stores.
On the positive side (hopefully) we have elections later this year.

That is a really impressive list. Although any bad news compilation could make any country look like Haiti, I hardly see any positive news.

The other day I saw a pretty impressive graphic illustration of the demographic impact of Covid / current crisis (source: La Nacion):


(on a side note: this chart is also pretty good example on how to graphically manipulate numbers; e.g. the 5% of the clase alta in the 2019 chart is nowhere close a 1/4 of the area of the clase baja extrema (20%). But still the dynamic of these shifts in just over a year is impressive)

Reading this thread made me also ask a question: apparently this current situation / crisis (depression?) seems to affect the expats here in very different ways. Personally I find it increasingly hard to enjoy the city life here (not much because of Covid / lockdown), although I really do love Buenos Aires. I walk through microcentro, and half of the stores are for rent or for sale (it has the charm of a cemetery). I walk through the streets and see so much more poverty, people who fell off the cart (irrevocably). There is a guy literally living a guy in car wrack in front of my house. I have a lot of friends / family who either lost their job and are struggling to make ends meet. In short: although I am personally not directly affected by all this mess, I feel this whole thing drags me more and more down.

And then there are guys here who seem to be totally unaffected by all this ("Crisis? What crisis??"). I am not morally judging this (in the sense that one should feel bad because the majority of the people here are struggling), but I am really curious on how you keep the spirits up and don't let you drag down.

 

[QuilmesSlo]

There are legitimate concerns about the trajectory of the country, and no easy answers are at hand.

If you have a plan b (which you should), put it out of mind and enjoy yourself today. You are a guest in a large country; you cannot impact events; worrying offers little return.

 

[sts7049]

That is a really impressive list. Although any bad news compilation could make any country look like Haiti, I hardly see any positive news.

The other day I saw a pretty impressive graphic illustration of the demographic impact of Covid / current crisis (source: La Nacion):

View attachment 7676
(on a side note: this chart is also pretty good example on how to graphically manipulate numbers; e.g. the 5% of the clase alta in the 2019 chart is nowhere close a 1/4 of the area of the clase baja extrema (20%). But still the dynamic of these shifts in just over a year is impressive)

Reading this thread made me also ask a question: apparently this current situation / crisis (depression?) seems to affect the expats here in very different ways. Personally I find it increasingly hard to enjoy the city life here (not much because of Covid / lockdown), although I really do love Buenos Aires. I walk through microcentro, and half of the stores are for rent or for sale (it has the charm of a cemetery). I walk through the streets and see so much more poverty, people who fell off the cart (irrevocably). There is a guy literally living a guy in car wrack in front of my house. I have a lot of friends / family who either lost their job and are struggling to make ends meet. In short: although I am personally not directly affected by all this mess, I feel this whole thing drags me more and more down.

And then there are guys here who seem to be totally unaffected by all this ("Crisis? What crisis??"). I am not morally judging this (in the sense that one should feel bad because the majority of the people here are struggling), but I am really curious on how you keep the spirits up and don't let you drag down.

i don't get that down because my time here is temporary and am fortunate to have a good stable job and situation. in previous years i kept balance by leaving a couple times a year, so that part is wearing on me now thanks to the pandemic restricting everything. but in the big picture i know i will be out of here so i ignore most of the stupidity.